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namelessentity
01-07-2011, 12:49 PM
I think it is a bit much to spring on the last minute, but I really like it. Some of the items seem overpowered and might need some tinkering.

I like that it gives the mafia something else to lie about. Assuming multiple items of the same description (and of course there will be) they could get a potion of hallucination and claim it as a potion of water. Someone else with that potion would think it safe and then be horribly nerfed for the town vote. It has promise, and as someone who really wanted team engineer to win, I'll be voting for this.

dtsund
01-07-2011, 01:13 PM
Looks pretty interesting. My only question is, will it be made public who won which item once the auction phase is over? Like, will people know once I have a cloudy potion in my possession or will that be something you can bluff your way through?

It'll be secret, unless someone drinks a Potion of Object Detection or sees you thanks to a Ring of Searching (and the former is the only one guaranteed to show it).

namelessentity: I typed that up at the last minute because I only just thought of it today.

Karzac
01-07-2011, 01:29 PM
I like it a lot, dtsund. SOme of the stuff could do with clarification, but it's a cool ruleset. I especially like some of the potions.

dwolfe
01-07-2011, 02:00 PM
dtsund:

NetMafia is brilliant, a couple comments:

1.) AMULET of life-saving damn it!

2.) I'd like to see the tourist also start with a T-shirt. If killed, he gets to post a posthumous .jpg or .gif of his choice. Just for kicks, like M8 Dan. Yes, this intentionally confirms he was a townie after the fact, who else would get a T-shirt?

3.) I wouldn't mind seeing a couple other random (weak) roles assigned to townies and mafia for flavour, but may be overly complicated or game-breaking e.g.:

Mail Daemon (mafia): may send one PM to all other mafia members (and GM) during the day.

Wizard (town): gets two charges to start from any wand OR may add an additional charge to a wand each night, with a 50% risk of blowing up the wand.

Succubus (mafia): may seduce one player per night, who is then too distracted to use any items (if asked to be used, items are not used up, basically the saboteur role).

Priest (town): gets two uses out of potions by 'blessing' them just before use.

Healer (town): your years of study means that you get two uses out of any scroll you choose to read, not just one (exception: scroll of scare monster, as double angel protection is too good).

dtsund
01-07-2011, 02:15 PM
1.) AMULET of life-saving damn it!

I'm well aware! But if I'd have done it like that, then the auction list could be something like

A ruby potion
A marble ring
A scroll labeled HACKEM MUCHE
A triangular amulet
A scroll labeled XIXAXA XOXAXA XUXAXA

And players would instantly know what that amulet is. I couldn't think of any good powers for the other amulets, either, so I just made it a ring.

As for the other stuff, I think players are going to have their hands full just keeping track of items and their possible identities. To be honest, I'm thinking of removing the two special roles I mentioned above.

kaisel
01-07-2011, 05:42 PM
Here's the revised pitch, it's not perfect, but I'm feeling pretty awful right now (flu, again!), so I figured I'd throw it out there, despite wanting to work on it some more.


It's 1926, and world currently rejoices, celebrating the end of the first World War. The mob and the less-reputable lounge in speakeasies, while the cops and detectives hunt them. Yet, something ominous stirs ,and a dark cloud looms over Arkham. Something ancient and monstrous lurks, and only a handful of the town stands against them, unaware of the traitors in their midst. Can the Town root out the evil, or will the Old Ones prevail?

Each player is an Investigator, something of an extraordinary person fighting against the Darkness. Unknown to the Investigators, however, the Old Ones' minions have infiltrated the hunting party, determined to mislead the Investigators, until the time is right for their Master to enter the world, and crush the world under their heel.

Each Investigator will have to explore locations, to attempt to gather clues, while the Infiltrators try to lure their adversaries to a quick and sudden death. The following locations are included:

South Church
Curiositie Shoppe
River Docks
Miskatonik University
Police station

Each Investigator will have a starting location among these, and before the start of the Night Phase must choose a location to investigate, otherwise they will stay in their current location. The Infiltrators will only be able to kill a townie during the Night Phase that is in a location with an Infiltrator.

At certain locations, roles will have access to certain aspects of their powers. The following roles will be in the game:
Town

Fighter: You're tough, so your vote counts as two. This power is usable at any location during the Day Phase.
Soldier: The Soldier is skilled with long range weaponry, and is an expert killer. During the Night Phase, the Soldier can kill anyone who is not in the same location as themselves, though they only get 1-3 rounds of weaponry.
Detective: See the End
Teleporter: Your eldritch machine allows you to be in two locations at once, though you'll only be recorded in one, that you specify. At the University, you can allow someone in your location to also gain the benefits of your teleportation power, so that a Detective, for example, could track the people in the University and another location. However the Teleporter will have to specify who they want to use this power on.
Medium: You can contact the souls of the dead that have died in your current location (lynchees are assumed to have died in their current location, not where they're trying to get to), and any who commit to the Town and can still speak in the thread, if they wish during the Night Phase. Any who do so are prevented from joining the Dark Priest. The Medium can act as a protector, preventing the death of any single player. This is a one use power. Alternatively they can prevent the death of any Player in their location at any time, although the Mafia can choose a different target. This is not a one use power.
Cop: Unlike a detective, you're just a beat cop. If someone in your location is killed either by lynching, or in the night phase, you may choose to sacrifice yourself, saving him, leaving your weapon, turning the one you saved into a Fighter

Mafia

Negater: When you vote for someone, you actually subtract a vote from that person
Cultist: You're able to convert someone to your cause, if they are in your location.
Dark Priest: You can harvest the souls of the dead, and bind them to your will, of anyone who has died in your location. Any dead townsperson can be added to the Wave that you wish, to help the Mafia plan, and can also communicate with you during the day phase to give hints. All dead who agree to help will be converted to the winning team. If the Dark Priest is in the same location as the Medium, they can choose to negate the Medium's protection power.


Clue tokens will be distributed randomly across the map, anyone in a location gets that clue token.

-1 Clue Token: Biased Evidence
You managed to cobble together enough evidence about every townsperson, that in a pinch you could probably convince the town to kill the other guy instead of you.
If you're in a stalemate for votes, the person who is tied with you will be lynched instead. If s/he also has Biased Evidence, the person with the next highest vote total gets lynched[b].

-2 Clue Tokens: Binoculars
Just a simple pair of binoculars, at least you can see around town.
[b]Using this will give you the name of a random person in another location

-3 Clue Tokens: Comprehensive Map
There are maps of the city that are handed out to tourists that tell you how to get around Arkham, and then there are the maps scrawled out by the bootleggers and the sketchy. You've managed to get one of these maps, and you know your way around the city.
Since you know the alleys and byways of the city, the Mafia will not be able to tell that you're a location with them

-4 Clue Tokens: Revolver
An unlicensed, untraceable revolver owned by a mobster. You managed to collect enough clues to find where it was stashed, so here we are. What will you do with it?
During the night phase you can kill someone in your location. You have to tell the GM you plan to use your Revolver during the Day Phase, and during the Night Phase you will get a list of people in your location, and you can choose to kill one. However, should you not choose to kill anyone during the night, the gun will be discovered, and you will be killed wrestling for the weapon.[/i] Instead of getting a Revolver, the Infiltrators instead know that someone is gunning for them, and therefore can't be night-killed for a single night.

-5 Clue Tokens: Definitive Evidence
You managed to find enough clues and evidence about a single person, so you know whether they're an ally... or a monster.
This effectively acts as the Investigator's power, you get the allegiance of any one player that you wish.

-5 Clue Tokens: Detailed Dossiers
You've managed to collect a lot of information on each Townsperson, at least, superficial details. You know clothing, shoe types, who smokes, who doesn't, what sorts of things people leave behind.
This allows you to get a list of everyone in your location, based on the evidence left in the morning.

Location/Role tweaks:
-The Dark Priest can negate the Medium's power if they share the same location, and can choose to do this. This includes the South Church. However, if the Dark Priest negates the protection power, they lose the ability to summon any ghosts to their cause.[]This way the Infiltrators have to find out who the Medium is to really do much[/i]

-The Detective role is changed to reducing the amount of clue tokens needed for each item by 2, to a minimum of 0. I like the Detective role, and I think it's flavorful to let them have the ability to put two and two together, thus reducing the need for Clue Tokens

-At the Curiousitie Shoppe, there will be random discounts for the some of the clue token powers, and could potentially be used for balancing reasons, if for some reason the game goes to hell pretty quickly (this will only be used after discussion with some non-players, due to wanting to make sure not to reward bad play or punish good play).

At the start of each Day Phase, the list of locations will be posted, along with the number of people at each location, and who has died. Lynches work the same as most games, people can vote during the day, and the one with the most votes is the one who is lynched. If no consensus is reached, the paranoia overrides everyone, and a random Townsfolk is killed.

Paul le Fou
01-09-2011, 05:26 AM
Dtsund, one question. People are bidding on and using items with random effects? And the only way to figure out what they do is to use them, have someone say what each color/type does, and go from there?

I'm wondering if that will work. I guess it has to do with the item saturation - just how many items will be available each day and how willing people would end up being to reveal what the item does. A setup like that seems to run the risk of falling apart pretty dramatically as people lose the ability to plan or strategize until the very end of the game, having spent the entire first half wasting their items on effects they couldn't have possibly planned for.

Especially problematic to me is how different some of the effects are. It might work better if each category of item did a very similar thing, the way a certain group of the potions does (stop them from speaking, voting, or both). That way, if you're married to the random effects idea, people can plan to use the item and have some idea of what they're getting themselves into instead of getting blindsided with a power completely unrelated to what they suspected.

But even moreso, the purely logistic problems of having active and reactive and informational powers in the same category - like having potions that block speech, reveal inventories, and grant one-use powers from polymorph - would likely cause as many headaches (and rule confusions) for you as they would for the player who doesn't know how to use them. Also, two layers of randomness (it MIGHT be a polymorph, and THEN you don't know what the effect would be) is not a good idea to my mind.

dtsund
01-09-2011, 01:03 PM
My plan was to have around five items available for bidding each day. Each item would first have, oh, a one in four chance of being a Scroll of Identify; otherwise, it would be a random item (I'd put this in the thread OP if it actually won, but this seems unlikely). In all likelihood, it would pretty quickly become obvious what the Scroll of Identify was, so that would help with the ID game.

The potion of polymorph could potentially be removed, sure. Actually, if anyone wants to look through the items of NetHack (http://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Items) and suggest additions to or removals from the list, I'd welcome it.

My idea for the game would be that the item identities would constitute a sort of metaknowledge that players would need to carefully control, sort of like how Inspectors need to carefully choose when to reveal themselves in more standard rules.


Actually, since this game looks like it's losing, I may try to refine it further. It might be interesting to make the Scroll of Mail similarly common (bumping up the total number of items per day a bit to compensate for the fact that half of them are going to be Mail or Identify), while giving the Demons a bit more money than the townspeople; this would open up avenues to potentially share information, with the caveat being that if they aren't careful, the Demons could forcefully outbid the players for powerful things like the Wand of Wishing or Ring of Life Saving.

Destil
01-10-2011, 04:41 PM
Oh, man. I just realized the absolute perfect setting for my next pitch. I've had a rule set & theme bouncing around in my head since M2 that I've never presented, and the next game would be ideal... :D

Karzac
01-10-2011, 05:38 PM
I think I've also come up with a really good setting. Flavourful, but something that most people would be able to understand. Now I just need a ruleset for it...

Phantoon
01-10-2011, 11:10 PM
Anniversary Mafia would definitely get my vote for Mafia X.

Merus
01-11-2011, 07:14 PM
Looks like I've already missed out :(

Invite to the Fourth Wall, please!

namelessentity
01-11-2011, 07:58 PM
Excellent opener, this game looks like it is going to be truly top notch. Forth Wall invite, please, when you get around to it. No rush, day 1 is fun when you aren't the one everybody is eying.

Destil
01-11-2011, 10:03 PM
And the greatest thing about role playing a six solar sweep 13 year old: my horrid spelling and lack-luster grammar and editing are just 'in character'.

dwolfe
01-12-2011, 06:57 AM
4th wall invite plz when it is up

Tanto
01-12-2011, 10:41 AM
Oh, I can already tell that this one is going to annoy the fuck out of me. I can't wait until people get bored with trying to talk in-character.

Alpha Werewolf
01-12-2011, 11:43 AM
I can't wait until people get bored with trying to talk in-character.

HAHAHAno.

chady
01-12-2011, 04:19 PM
I'd like a Fourth Wall invite, please.

Falselogic
01-13-2011, 09:52 PM
I was thinking the first post in this thread should probably be updated to a big ol FAQ on Mafia: the game. How it is played, what to expect when you decide to play it. maybe some links to references to the math behind the game and perhaps some strategies, as well as some explanations for the rules this forum uses while they are playing.

That way people who want to play or have started their first game have some kind of expectation as to what they are getting themselves into and the rules won't seem so random and arbitrary.

That way it won't happen in the actual games threads. Also don't say people can just read old threads because they are nigh unintelligible to the uninitiated.

Just a thought, though I think a good one.

Paul le Fou
01-13-2011, 10:08 PM
I have to admit I'm getting kind of tempted
to start talking like this all the time
let's hope I do get bored of it before the end of the game
or I'm in for a world of hurt
no
we all are

McClain
01-13-2011, 10:10 PM
Can't. Stop. Reading. Homestuck.

I need to finish this soon. I want to be able to suggest actions.

Goddammit, Nich. Between this and actually playing mafia, my free time is officially ruined.

Adam
01-14-2011, 09:15 AM
I WARNED YOU ABOUT READING BRO!!!!!

I TOLD YOU DOG!

shivam
01-14-2011, 10:43 AM
I was thinking the first post in this thread should probably be updated to a big ol FAQ on Mafia: the game. How it is played, what to expect when you decide to play it. maybe some links to references to the math behind the game and perhaps some strategies, as well as some explanations for the rules this forum uses while they are playing.

That way people who want to play or have started their first game have some kind of expectation as to what they are getting themselves into and the rules won't seem so random and arbitrary.

That way it won't happen in the actual games threads. Also don't say people can just read old threads because they are nigh unintelligible to the uninitiated.

Just a thought, though I think a good one.

this is a good idea.

Destil
01-14-2011, 12:52 PM
I WARNED YOU ABOUT READING BRO!!!!!

I TOLD YOU DOG!

It keeps happening.

locit
01-14-2011, 03:59 PM
Oh, I can already tell that this one is going to annoy the fuck out of me. I can't wait until people get bored with trying to talk in-character.
W3ll I'm n3v3r going to g3t tir3d of r3ading it. 3xtra points to Brickroad for th3 wond3rful flavor t3xt. :3

Tanto
01-14-2011, 06:09 PM
W3ll I'm n3v3r going to g3t tir3d of r3ading it. 3xtra points to Brickroad for th3 wond3rful flavor t3xt. :3

You don't have to read through the whole thing and summarise it.

McClain
01-14-2011, 06:20 PM
You don't have to read through the whole thing and summarise it.

"Som3 shit was said, som3 shit happ3n3d, som3on3 was killed."

:D

McClain
01-14-2011, 06:27 PM
GM: if one more person changes their vote
GM: I am going to fly off the handle so fast
GM: it will be like Christopher Reeves in Superman
GM: all spinning the earth backwards
GM: reversing time to before I was dumb enough to run a game with 26 indecisive lunatics


Day one results

A meteor hit the earth and everyone died game over fuckers.

Adam
01-14-2011, 06:27 PM
There is no sane environment here, and you are quite sure there never was. You wonder why you thought otherwise.

JohnB
01-14-2011, 06:30 PM
Day one results

A meteor hit the earth and everyone died game over fuckers.

I think I love you.

dtsund
01-14-2011, 06:30 PM
GM: if one more person changes their vote
GM: I am going to fly off the handle so fast
GM: it will be like Christopher Reeves in Superman
GM: all spinning the earth backwards
GM: reversing time to before I was dumb enough to run a game with 26 indecisive lunatics


Just doin' my part.

Think of it this way: Tomorrow, there will only be 24 indecisive lunatics!

McClain
01-14-2011, 07:36 PM
Sorry about that one, Yim. I hope you don't think we are a bunch of dicks and don't play with us ever again!

Not that we aren't a bunch of dicks.

dtsund
01-14-2011, 07:43 PM
Trapped in a game what trolls are in
And everyone knows the only ones left
Were Nodal, me and Yim.

When it shut down and we were free
The only ones left to see the end
Were Nodal and me

Yimothy, Yimothy, Nodal's lookin' at you
Yimothy, Yimothy, God what did we do?

shivam
01-14-2011, 09:38 PM
i had a feeling.

Dizzy
01-14-2011, 09:41 PM
GUYS I KNEW YIMOTHY WAS INNOCENTZ I AM INNOCENT

McClain
01-14-2011, 09:47 PM
GUYS I KNEW YIMOTHY WAS INNOCENTZ I AM INNOCENT

METAGAME REACTION TO METAGAMING

(slightly edited)

Umby
01-14-2011, 09:53 PM
METAGAME REACTION

Destil
01-14-2011, 09:56 PM
For all games, let's just take it as read that you're all very sad about it or pretending to be, and pipe down during nighttime.

And maybe it's not too late to have some god-damn dignity in this thread, at least.

Phantoon
01-14-2011, 11:11 PM
i had a feeling.

Of course you did.

JohnB
01-15-2011, 03:12 AM
And maybe it's not too late to have some god-damn dignity in this thread, at least.

Tanto
01-15-2011, 12:21 PM
Four hundred posts and you guys' ridiculous leet-speak. My brains. :(

Day 1
~Posts #3-393~

Apparently this game has some manner of internet theme, so everyone's required to write like retards for the duration.

The first real moves of the game feature shivam, widdershins, and fanboymaster attempting to figure out which roles are in play. There is also some discussion, half in jest, about whether Destil or kaisel are "due" to be Mafia or Citizen, respectively.

Brickroad notes that the Inspector is much more powerful in this variant, because they can potentially get both a clean and a dirty verdict in a single night, rather than simply one or the other. Phantoon says the Citizens should assume they have no Inspector for now rather than relying on one being there and getting caught with their pants down if he doesn't exist.

Paul le Fou and Alpha Werewolf vote for Brickroad for being annoying. (Which he is, totally.) Alpha Werewolf also exhorts the Citizens to stop with the theorycrafting. Byron agrees that rules clarifications are fine, but attempting to plan is dangerous. Kaisel, however, states that the Citizens will eventually need a plan if they're going to win, and there's only so much the Mafia can do to interfere with a well-implemented plan.

There is some discussion as to the potential guilt of Adam and Phantoon, specifically as to whether "lurking" is particularly damning this early in the game.

Is intentionally putting a Mafioso into the server a good idea? Byron doesn't think so, but some other players, including Phantoon, are willing to consider the idea. For this reason, he attracts the attention of shivam and Nodal, who vote for him. JohnB finds this sudden rush to condemn Phantoon suspicious, as does Karzac, who points out that he (Karzac) was the first one to mention the possibility of introducing a Mafioso into the server, so it's not like Phantoon was the grand champion of the idea or anything.

Brickroad votes for Nodal in self-defense.

More game theory, this time about how valuable titles are as a source of information. Tock says he'd raise an eyebrow at anyone using them as the crux of their argument, but they could be useful in the right situation. Brickroad says that if the Citizens can figure out a role from a title, the faction will usually follow.

Yimothy makes a long theory post, which Byron immediately jumps on as being fundamentally flawed. Byron likens Yimothy to Mazokunomiko in... M7, I think?... and votes for him. Yimothy tries to direct attention in Brickroad's direction, but Brickroad doesn't bite, and accuses Yimothy as well. A few players jump on the bandwagon, but others, including Phantoon and Umby, express discomfort with the idea of killing a newbie on Day 1. Shivam, for his part, says "fuck newbie immunity," due to the fact that Karzac used it to nearly take over the game in M8.

McClain and Alpha Werewolf argue about a slip of the tongue by Wheels for what seems like hours.

Tock votes for Yimothy in order to tie the vote, then retracts it when Nodal adds his vote to the Yimothy pile, claiming he wants to see a tie for now. Karzac and spineshark note this as a potentially suspicious move. Tock later explains that he wants to see how the undecided vote when they're under the gun, under the theory that the Mafia might vote in a bloc in the last hours of the Day to keep one of their own from dying. He admits that it doesn't tell the Citizens much if both Yimothy and Nodal are innocent.

Nodal makes a lengthy defense post in which he points out every potentially fishy thing Yimothy has ever said. This is enough to earn the support of McClain and shivam, and Yimothy is sent to the gallows at Day's end. He is revealed to be innocent.

Dizzy
01-15-2011, 02:10 PM
Tanto. Your objectivity is faultering here.

*salutes*

JohnB
01-15-2011, 05:31 PM
I WARNED YOU ABOUT READING BRO!!!!!

I TOLD YOU DOG!

I didn't listen. (http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=6&p=002999)

AT: sHOULD i BE PERTURBED BY THESE ALLUSIONS,
TG: no man
TG: look
TG: i just need to know when to be there
TG: when the stars come into alignment and your flux capacitor lets you finally sate your meteoric greed for crotch-dachshund
TG: i wouldnt want to miss it and cause a paradox or something
TG: itd suck if the universe blew up on account of you missing your window of opportunity to help yourself to a pubescent boy's naked spam porpoise
AT: uHHH,
AT: oK, THIS IS SORT OF STARTING TO UPSET ME,
TG: jesus you are such a shitty troll

Yimothy
01-16-2011, 03:03 AM
Sorry about that one, Yim. I hope you don't think we are a bunch of dicks and don't play with us ever again!

0|\/|G 5O 4|\|GRY \/\/|7|-| j00 9|_|Y5!!!!!!!!!!!!!111!!!

Nah, it's cool. That's the way the mop flops, you know? Maybe next time I'll hire an editor to cut the suspicious bits outta my posts.

i had a feeling.

This is the way!

widdershins
01-16-2011, 06:12 PM
Tanto. Your objectivity is faultering here.


Needs moar widdershins.

McClain
01-16-2011, 08:01 PM
McSlain: Again?!?!

McSlain: *gasp* *gurgle* *thud*

Karzac
01-16-2011, 08:03 PM
McSlain: Again?!?!

McSlain: *gasp* *gurgle* *thud*

Dude, I think you should just go ahead and permanently change your username to McSlain.

Winter
01-16-2011, 08:04 PM
Sorry McClain. I promise you I'm only finding this a little funny.

namelessentity
01-16-2011, 08:32 PM
McClain, one of these days you'll make it to the end, no one else left standing, it will be just you. And you'll ask "What do I do now?"

And on that day, you'll understand how all along these people were trying to spare you the torture of never ending life

Also, I hope there was an actual reason for it and people aren't just killing you off for a dumb joke

Ted
01-17-2011, 03:44 PM
Four hundred posts and you guys' ridiculous leet-speak. My brains. :(

I'm tempted to write a de-leet bookmarklet but I think that would only encourage more hieroglyphics. I do secretly hope someone starts using カタカナ, though. At least that would offer some useful reading practice.

EDIT: Praise the gods, some kind soul has already done de-leet (http://operawiki.info/BookMarklets#zap).

fanboymaster
01-17-2011, 03:52 PM
ユ ドント リリ ワント ザト ヅ ユ?

Adam
01-17-2011, 04:00 PM
ユ ドント リリ ワント ザト ヅ ユ?

It's... full of stars!

Karzac
01-17-2011, 04:00 PM
I'm tempted to write a de-leet bookmarklet but I think that would only encourage more hieroglyphics. I do secretly hope someone starts using カタカナ, though. At least that would offer some useful reading practice.

EDIT: Praise the gods, some kind soul has already done de-leet (http://operawiki.info/BookMarklets#zap).

That's awesome! The only problem is that it changes all numbers into letters.

Ted
01-17-2011, 04:02 PM
イツ ベータ ザン アル ザト ホリバル リトスピク。マイ ブレンズ!

Nodal
01-17-2011, 04:04 PM
Google Translateは、おそらく皆さん吸う馬のチンポを言っている。

Ted
01-17-2011, 04:11 PM
That's awesome! The only problem is that it changes all numbers into letters.

Hmm, true. Too bad the author didn't add some logic to only apply it to selected text, if applicable. That could help. Perhaps I'll look into it.

EDIT: Meh, looks like there isn't a standard way to determine and manipulate selected text, meaning it would be a pain to get it working in all browsers. I'm going to go play video games, instead. :cool:

Javex
01-17-2011, 09:20 PM
I really hope "The Umby Cycle" becomes a permanent part of TT's mafia language.

Adam
01-17-2011, 09:22 PM
I have to say, I'm a little annoyed that Nich had to cut off signups because of people who have decided to sit around and not actually play. (Yes I know barely playing is a strategy. It's a dumb strategy.)

Additional discontent: Even if we could trade out the non-posters, people who actually wanted to play are already watching through the Fourth Wall.

Umby
01-17-2011, 09:27 PM
I really hope "The Umby Cycle" becomes a permanent part of TT's mafia language.

YOU CANNOT BREAK THE UMBY CYCLE

Paul le Fou
01-18-2011, 11:51 PM
I have to say, I'm a little annoyed that Nich had to cut off signups because of people who have decided to sit around and not actually play. (Yes I know barely playing is a strategy. It's a dumb strategy.)

Additional discontent: Even if we could trade out the non-posters, people who actually wanted to play are already watching through the Fourth Wall.

Yeah, that aspect of the fourth wall/champagne room particularly blows (amidst a general awesomeness, that is, don't get me wrong). Remember when we first started out? We had to have at least one or two subs per game for the first four, at least.

shivam
01-18-2011, 11:53 PM
actually, i'm starting to really hate the champaign room a lot. i understand why we need it, but i really miss the second conversation in this thread.

Dizzy
01-19-2011, 05:06 AM
The Fourth Wall is optional. Unless Nich set it up to be a non-spoiler discussion. If we planned on subbing players we should have called attention to this beforehand so people wouldn't join The Fourth Wall.

Merus
01-19-2011, 06:05 AM
I want to play another Thing game. I know people want a reunion game for Mafia X so maybe next time.

Adam
01-19-2011, 07:58 AM
The Fourth Wall is optional. Unless Nich set it up to be a non-spoiler discussion. If we planned on subbing players we should have called attention to this beforehand so people wouldn't join The Fourth Wall.

One does not simply plan to walk into Mordor.

Paul le Fou
01-19-2011, 07:06 PM
FUCK I had a big old post almost ready to go
it even started with
snazzerwhack: oh maybe we do have time
snazzerwhack: do I not know how this game works
snazzerwhack: how much is left ?


that's it I quit my job to play mafia full-time

METAGAME REACTION TO METAGAME REACTION TO DESE METANUTZ WHATEVER SUCK MY METADONG

Dizzy
01-19-2011, 07:08 PM
I have read Nich's last post four times.

I have no fucking idea what it just said.

Brickroad
01-19-2011, 07:08 PM
I love how widdershins's name is crossed out under Byron over and over again, forever.

Nich is currently banging his head against his desk. Cracks are beginning to emerge. (In the desk, but also in his head.)

Karzac
01-19-2011, 07:11 PM
I have read Nich's last post four times.

I have no fucking idea what it just said.

Byron's dead, he was a kid. The bomb stuff was just flavor.

widdershins
01-19-2011, 07:12 PM
Nich's post said that Byron was innocent, but didn't explode. It was indeed just flavor text. His character likes explosions, but can't do anything with 'em.

Adam
01-19-2011, 07:17 PM
/slow clap

Umby
01-19-2011, 07:28 PM
I don't know how to respond.

shivam
01-19-2011, 07:28 PM
don't. this is the meta thread, and we're not allowed to talk. you have two days to think about what you've done.

Umby
01-19-2011, 07:29 PM
I know that. That's why I'm not saying anything, and keeping my opinions to myself, sir!

Winter
01-20-2011, 11:06 AM
Gah, Byron said nice things about my work, too. Now I feel bad.

Anyways, I'd have posted this in the main thread, but we're not allowed so...I've got a bit of a surprise trip I need to go on from Friday until early Monday, and the only time I'll have internet access is when I'm in lounging in the hotel room, and I don't know how often that will be. So please don't lynch me for any change in posting habits/amounts.

Tanto
01-21-2011, 09:55 AM
Sorry this is late! I've been sick. In other news: Jesus Christ, you guys.

Day 2
~Posts #396-779~

The Day begins with the players discovering that McClain has been killed during the night (again).

Winter opens of the discussion with a volley at Paul le Fou, and also expresses suspicion of shivam and dtsund, characterizing their votes as pivotal in killing the innocent Yimothy. He also requests that the three Day 1 abstainers (Paul le Fou, SDMX, and Tock) explain themselves, a demand Karzac seconds (along with an accusal of Tock). Widdershins is iffy about Tock and shivam, but expresses uncertainty regarding Byron. Brickroad says that it would be a mistake to let SDMX off the hook due to supposed real-life issues.

Shivam and Paul le Fou discuss Byron's involvement in getting the Yimothy lynch off the ground. Paul le Fou accuses Byron, claiming his actions have been inconsistent with past Mafia games. Byron defends himself, saying that he's deeply suspicious of anyone who tries the "Don't kill me, I'm just a dumb noob!" strategy. Phantoon doesn't buy it, and accuses Byron of aiming for low-hanging, easily-lynched fruit. (Worst metaphor ever!)

Kaisel, uncomfortable with voting for Tock, instead slings his vote in Adam's direction. (Adam had previously been trying to shut down discussion of power roles, claiming it would give the Mafia ideas.) Phantoon praises Tock's late-day gambit and votes for Nodal, claiming that if Nodal is dirty, that gives the Citizens all kinds of new information to work with.

Nodal notes that Byron hardly started a bandwagon against Yimothy, as only one person (botticus) voted for Yimothy based on Byron's statements. Nodal votes for Adam instead for trying to stir up a witchhunt against Byron.

Botticus analyzes the Day 1 timeline and comes to the conclusion that Nodal is probably clean and dtsund probably dirty. Umby, however, disputes his conclusions, claiming that the Tock bandwagon was a distraction to keep attention off of Nodal. Umby accuses Nodal. There is some more discussion along these lines, with Karzac and Byron giving their thoughts. JohnB demands explainations from dtsund and Destil, who have remained oddly silent so far today.

Umby mournfully laments getting caught in the "Umby Cycle" again.

Discussion on the last few hours of Day 1 dominates the thread, with everything else moving to the background. Tock and widdershins ask for Destil to explain himself. Karzac exhorts the Citizens to ignore what happened on Day 1 and start talking about what's happening now, drawing the ire of Paul le Fou and Brickroad. Shivam votes for Karzac for trying to kill discussion. Brickroad votes for Alpha Werewolf, but says he might be swayed to Karzac, which he later does. Widdershins expresses skepticism with a Karzac vote, claiming it doesn't give the Citizens any extra information, a statement Phantoon and JohnB lambast.

Alpha Werewolf analyzes Byron's substantial posts and comes to the conclusion that he is Mafia, thanks to his playstyle matching up with M2W, the other time he's been Mafia. Destil concurs, and votes for Byron as well. Brickroad cheerfully jumps on the Byron bandwagon, as do widdershins and Phantoon. Tock, on the other hand, doesn't see the logic for killing Byron, and stays on Karzac instead.

With Byron receiving a solid majority, there's some discussion as to whether he could be the Bomb and, if so, what the Citizens should do about it. Byron claims to have figured out the inevitable Nichtwist -- namely, that he has a different role inside the medium and out of it. There is a lot of flailing around, mostly courtesy of widdershins, that I can't even begin to follow. Eventually Byron is killed, revealed to be a Citizen, and nothing crazy happens. Right?

namelessentity
01-21-2011, 11:22 AM
Seriously, Tanto, you make it infinitely easier to follow the on goings of this game. Thanks for sticking with it.

Karzac
01-21-2011, 11:39 AM
Tanto is the king.

botticus
01-21-2011, 11:56 AM
Since people in-game are reading these (amazing!) summaries, I just need to correct the statement about my analysis:

Botticus analyzes the Day 1 timeline and comes to the conclusion that Nodal is probably clean and dtsund probably dirty.

I'm inclined to believe Nodal's clean. [... an unlikely] alternative is dtsund waited until the last minute to save one of his trollish brothers.

I had not yet concluded anything about dtsund.

/metagaming

Thanks Tanto!

Destil
01-21-2011, 12:41 PM
I just did a search for my name to see how many mentions I got.

JohnB
01-21-2011, 01:18 PM
Since people in-game are reading these (amazing!) summaries, I just need to correct the statement about my analysis:

I had not yet concluded anything about dtsund.

/metagaming

Thanks Tanto!

FFS

We're correcting Tanto now? With citations? Jesus fucking Christ.

Alpha Werewolf
01-21-2011, 01:22 PM
FFS

We're correcting Tanto now? With citations? Jesus fucking Christ.

I corrected him during M8!

JohnB
01-21-2011, 01:25 PM
That's ridiculous too!

Destil
01-21-2011, 02:32 PM
Yeah, that needs to stop. I still want to get that nickel Brick offered in M3...

botticus
01-21-2011, 02:34 PM
FFS

We're correcting Tanto now? With citations? Jesus fucking Christ.
Er, yes?

Tanto
01-21-2011, 03:00 PM
I welcome corrections. Accuracy is more important than mindless praise.

Although I'll take mindless praise too, if you're willing to give it.

JohnB
01-21-2011, 03:09 PM
I welcome corrections. Accuracy is more important than mindless praise.

Although I'll take mindless praise too, if you're willing to give it.

Hey, if you're cool with it then I retract my previous FFS.

widdershins
01-21-2011, 04:04 PM
I didn't think my stuff was that hard to follow. I included summary posts and everything. :(

Still, I asked for moar widds, and more widds I received. A++ would read again.

McClain
01-21-2011, 04:55 PM
I welcome corrections. Accuracy is more important than mindless praise.

Although I'll take mindless praise too, if you're willing to give it.

Awesome summaries. Needs more McClain. :D

Nodal
01-21-2011, 05:16 PM
Between SDMX, fbm, Wheels, Destil, and now Tanto, I'm beginning to worry about this apparent Mafia Plague.

It's an MTD.

Karzac
01-21-2011, 06:14 PM
Between SDMX, fbm, Wheels, Destil, and now Tanto, I'm beginning to worry about this apparent Mafia Plague.

I smell a Mafia 10 theme!

McClain
01-21-2011, 06:21 PM
I want to play another Thing game. I know people want a reunion game for Mafia X so maybe next time.

Between SDMX, fbm, Wheels, Destil, and now Tanto, I'm beginning to worry about this apparent Mafia Plague.

I smell a Mafia 10 theme!

The stars are aligning.

Umby
01-21-2011, 08:52 PM
Sorry, Nich, my fault here. I explained it, but it's really MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Umby
01-21-2011, 08:55 PM
Do you want me to delete the post and repost the comment as myself?

Ted
01-22-2011, 10:12 AM
Sorry, Nich, my fault here. I explained it, but it's really MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

I can't tell if you just broke the Umby cycle or embellished it.

McClain
01-22-2011, 01:33 PM
The Umby Cycle has become self-aware! All hope is lost!

Kylie
01-22-2011, 02:01 PM
In my dreams, I am the bomb.

It's me.

Brickroad
01-22-2011, 02:55 PM
Someone set up us the Byron.

Adam
01-22-2011, 03:09 PM
Take off every 'Vig'

McClain
01-22-2011, 03:20 PM
ALL YOUR WHISKEY ARE BELONG TO US!

Alpha Werewolf
01-22-2011, 09:16 PM
ARE YOU A BAD ENOUGH DUDE TO RESCUE THE NOBLE OF POWER?

Javex
01-22-2011, 09:29 PM
THANK YOU BYRON!

BUT OUR WHISKEY IS IN ANOTHER CASK!

JohnB
01-23-2011, 07:41 AM
THANK YOU BYRON!

BUT OUR WHISKEY IS IN ANOTHER CASK!

This is clearly the winner.

Dizzy
01-23-2011, 07:05 PM
I miscalculated how much time I had.

I am now filled with the intense, galvanic rage of a nuclear explosion.

Brickroad
01-23-2011, 07:05 PM
hahaha awesome

Dizzy
01-23-2011, 07:07 PM
I honestly don't know what's going on but I'm saving it for the Fourth Wall since I am more than likely dead.

Fourth Wall access please!

Karzac
01-23-2011, 07:10 PM
I honestly don't know what's going on but I'm saving it for the Fourth Wall since I am more than likely dead.

Fourth Wall access please!

The Limiter used his power.

Umby
01-23-2011, 07:11 PM
FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

shivam
01-23-2011, 07:14 PM
oh SNAP>

Wheels
01-23-2011, 08:41 PM
ZOMG :eek:

widdershins
01-23-2011, 10:00 PM
/ooc Love the Troll 2 reference.

Alpha Werewolf
01-24-2011, 06:08 AM
Oh Nich if I die tonight gimme a Fourth Wall invite.

Wheels
01-24-2011, 07:47 AM
Between SDMX, fbm, Wheels, Destil, and now Tanto, I'm beginning to worry about this apparent Mafia Plague.

Hey who you calling a plague mister?

Falselogic
01-24-2011, 08:28 AM
Damn you spend a weekend with the wife and the mafia thread goes crazy!

Wheels
01-24-2011, 08:41 AM
Damn you spend a weekend with the wife and the mafia thread goes crazy!

I know, right?

MADNESS

Winter
01-24-2011, 09:48 AM
All right, back from my trip, got the morning off work, I'm ready to break this wide o...

oh.

Adam
01-24-2011, 09:52 AM
I AM ALSO POSTING ABOUT HOW SURPRISED I WAS THAT THE DAY ENDED EARLY! I AM THE MOST BELIEVABLE EVER!

Tanto
01-24-2011, 10:05 AM
Day 3
~Posts #783-903~

The Day begins with the Citizens discovering that the Mafia targetted Alpha Werewolf during the Night, but were rebuffed.

Shivam gets things rolling by accusing Brickroad, saying that his play at the end of Day 2 was shady.

Alpha Werewolf comes clean: He is the Angel, and protected himself. He recommends looking at players who did not vote for Byron on Day 2, perhaps trying to give themselves an alibi.

Widdershins makes a long post analyzing the votes from Day 2. The primary result to come out of this is some suspicion against Dizzy, who lobbied for widdershins to reveal his role when the Citizens believed that Byron might be on the verge of blowing up in his face. However, widdershins votes for Paul le Fou, who widdershins feels was trying to get Byron lynched because the Mafia feared doing it themselves.

Karzac votes for Brickroad, pointing out that his voting record contains a lot of confirmed innocents. Brickroad claims that he will always kill Byron if possible because Byron is impossible for him to read, and that although he would never try and start a Byron-wagon himself, he'd be happy to jump on one in progress. He revenge-accuses Karzac. This arouses Alpha Werewolf's attention, who also votes for Brickroad. JohnB says that Brickroad looks "really bad" and votes for him. Destil expresses skepticism with the speed at which the Brickroad bandwagon is accelerating.

Botticus votes for Dizzy, but says that he is open to an explanation as to why Dizzy was pressing so hard for a role reveal. Dizzy later explains that he feared that, if widdershins did die, the Citizens wouldn't be able to learn anything from his death and the Mafia would be able to safely front his role. This excuse isn't good enough for spineshark, who votes for Dizzy.

Nodal votes for Adam, accusing him of masterminding the Byron bandwagon. Adam points out that the Byron voting didn't really get going until two almost-certainly-confirmed-clean players, Alpha Werewolf and widdershins, kick-started it, and votes for Nodal right back.

Paul le Fou and JohnB discuss whether Brickroad's flavor text might be hinting as to his allegiance. Brickroad, claiming frustration with this line of logic, declares that before the Day is over, he will reveal his title and role. He also confirms that he is not in the medium.

...And, just like that, the Day ends, 24 real-time hours early, as the Limiter acts. Dizzy is leading the vote count, but I don't think he's lynched. Right?

Karzac
01-24-2011, 10:20 AM
No, the end of day text stated that Dizzy was dead and he was a kid. It was pretty black and white. (Okay, light green and white.)

Yeah, I don't know how anybody was confused about this.

Tanto
01-24-2011, 10:38 AM
No, the end of day text stated that Dizzy was dead and he was a kid. It was pretty black and white. (Okay, light green and white.)

All righty then. RTFFT next time, I guess. (I usually look for black, bolded text.)

McClain
01-24-2011, 01:17 PM
I AM ALSO POSTING ABOUT HOW SURPRISED I WAS THAT THE DAY ENDED EARLY! I AM THE MOST BELIEVABLE EVER!

Don't ever change.

kaisel
01-28-2011, 04:25 PM
We're kind of skirting the edge of the "hey everyone post your PMs!" antics that the rules explicitly prevent. Scale it back a little, please. Or I will modkill you.

Sorry, I'm scaling it back.

I'll explain my reasoning after the game, it honestly wasn't trying to be a "spot the bad PM" move

widdershins
01-28-2011, 07:06 PM
I'm so sorry, Tanto. Really, I am.

Falselogic
01-28-2011, 07:07 PM
I'm so sorry, Tanto. Really, I am.

please, despite your verbosity what you actually managed to do can be summed up in a sentence or two...

I'm somewhat amazed that Tanto does these things though... Guy must just really like Mafia...

botticus
01-28-2011, 07:08 PM
Nich's flavor is so fun.

Falselogic
01-28-2011, 07:08 PM
Nich's flavor is so fun.

seconded.

widdershins
01-28-2011, 08:33 PM
please, despite your verbosity what you actually managed to do can be summed up in a sentence or two...

I'm somewhat amazed that Tanto does these things though... Guy must just really like Mafia...

Well, there's also the conversation/argument it all spawned. Even then, even if it's easy to sum up, poor guy still has to read it all.

Umby
01-28-2011, 08:54 PM
seconded.

Thirded!

Adam
01-28-2011, 09:27 PM
Thirded!

Flexed!

Phantoon
01-28-2011, 11:46 PM
Fifthed. If that's a word.

Falselogic
01-29-2011, 09:36 AM
Well, there's also the conversation/argument it all spawned. Even then, even if it's easy to sum up, poor guy still has to read it all.

too true...

Tanto
01-29-2011, 10:16 AM
I feel the need to reiterate: Jesus Christ you guys.

Day 4
~Posts #906-1263~

The Day begins with Alpha Werewolf being targeted by the Mafia again. As he tapped his power the previous Night to save himself, this time he succumbs.

The premature end to the previous Day, before Brickroad could reveal himself, makes him look really shady, and he wastes no time in lamenting that fact. Karzac queries Brickroad regarding his actions on the previous Day. Botticus notes that Brickroad and fanboymaster's votes were conveniently timed; about two hours before the truncated Day end. Fanboymaster argues that the smart Mafia ploy would be to not vote and then claim surprise at the premature Day ending, since it provides less information and can't really be argued.

Kaisel posts the voting records and analyzes them. He comes to the conclusion that if Brickroad or Phantoon is guilty, Karzac likely isn't. He also notes that Brickroad has voted for every known innocent at least once so far. Botticus wonders if there's any value remaining in examining the pre-Byron voting on Day 2 -- he claims he had planned to do so in the latter hours of the previous Day, but was preempted.

Dtsund speculates that the Mafia decided to end the Day early in order to preempt Alpha Werewolf's habitual end-of-day suspicion post, but the joke was on them because he posted it earlier than usual. Winter later agrees that the Mafia might have panicked and wanted to curtail Alpha Werewolf's usage as a confirmed Citizen as much as possible.

Brickroad claims that his offer of a role+title reveal was based on his being in immediate danger of a lynching. Once Dizzy pulled ahead, he didn't feel it was necessary any more. Winter suggests lynching Brickroad just for information. Brickroad throws up his hands and reveals both his title and his role (Oracle). Widdershins argues that Brickroad's actions make him less suspicious, not more, as a Mafioso with foreknowledge of the Limiter's action would try and lay low during the abbreviated Day rather than make big flailing movements that look bad when the Day ends early. Widdershins likes Paul le Fou and botticus as lynch targets instead. Adam agrees that Brickroad probably just made a stupid move, rather than a malicious one.

Destil takes up the cause of the Day 3 non-voters, claiming that while a legitimate excuse it's also a really safe place for Mafia to hide. Phantoon declares that he had resolved to only vote on the real-life third day of Days in order to keep from getting caught with his pants down by the Limiter. Widdershins also steps in, and uses it to reemphasize his suspicions of Paul le Fou and botticus.

Phantoon and kaisel circle each other warily.

Nodal votes for Brickroad, on the grounds that one of his previous votes sounds like an attempt to get into Nodal's good graces by voting for one of his nemeses. Umby and SDMX concur and add their votes to the Brickroad pile. Karzac votes for Brickroad in order to give the lie to widdershins's idea that he and Brickroad are allies. Brickroad shrugs and says that since his accusers have already made up their minds, there's no point in his defending himself. Adam points out (much later) that giving up when you're on the block is "giving a giant middle finger" to the Town, even if you're innocent.

Paul le Fou demands that more attention be paid to Destil and spineshark, who are good players who have had a tangible effect on the game, but have managed to slide under the radar thus far.

Widdershins suggests going after Nodal, claiming that killing him would give the Citizens better information than killing Brickroad. Brickroad's death only provides information if he's guilty, while Nodal's death can help no matter what his affiliation. Wheels agrees, citing M6, when Nodal was guilty and managed to fly under everyone's nose for almost the entire game.

JohnB votes for Brickroad for not acting like his normal self, then retracts it a few posts later when Mt. Brickroad erupts.

Brickroad declares that Umby is being "willfully disingenuous" and hoping no one calls him on it. Umby claims that Brickroad is lying, and that he's the Oracle. Falselogic muses that it's entirely possible that the Town could have two Oracles. Brickroad accuses Umby "for obvious reasons." Adam votes for Brickroad. Phantoon tells people to stop revealing their roles unless they've got real information to give, and Umby responds that he was trying to get Brickroad lynched normally, but felt he had to reveal when momentum started shifting away from him. Widdershins points out that duplicate roles don't necessarily mean someone is lying, so Umby should shut his pie-hole and read the rules again.

Kaisel suggests getting Brickroad and Umby to simultaneously reveal how their powers work, so that the Town can hunt for discrepancies. Adam agrees.

Widdershins suggests trying to put Brickroad into the medium, and the Town can proceed based on what happens. Kaisel raises his eyebrow at this, thanks to the presence of the Troll's role-changing power, but JohnB likes the sound of it. Widdershins concedes that the Scrambler "complicates things," but notes that if the Mafia uses it, Brickroad might trade his relatively useless power for a better one. Adam and Nodal still want to see a powers standoff, but Tock points out that Nich might have anticipated just this strategem. Widdershins warms up even more to the medium plan, pointing out that if the players agree more-or-less unanimously to do it, the Town gains some information regarding future events.

Paul le Fou and Karzac vote against the medium plan, the first in verse, the latter calling it a "comedy of fucking errors." (How literate!) Destil votes against it as well. Widdershins continues to defend it passionately, though. Eventually the plan gets enough support that it's tentatively agreed upon, and discussion shifts on who to lynch today. Botticus says that, in the absence of Brickroad or Umby as viable candidates, Nodal looks like the frontrunner. Adam and Brickroad immediately vote for Nodal.

Nodal posts a long analysis of Adam's posts, concluding with a vote for him. This is good enough for Karzac, JohnB, shivam, and Wheels, who all vote for Adam. Widdershins says that he finds Nodal to be the more compelling candidate. However, Adam reveals his role: He's the Inspector, and fingers Destil and widdershins as likely innocents and Nodal as guilty. This shifts the momentum back in Nodal's direction. Nodal claims the Killer role in an attempt to save himself, to no avail. Nodal is lynched, and revealed to be Mafia.

Tanto
01-29-2011, 10:18 AM
In all seriousness, the summarizing isn't that difficult. It helps that you guys are often needlessly wordy and like to wander in circles. :)

It makes my day every time I can sum up an eight-page pissing match as "So-and-Such and Such-and-So argue for a while."

Karzac
01-29-2011, 10:33 AM
Tanto, you're the best. You're summaries seem to be getting better, even though you have so much to read through. Never leave us.

widdershins
01-29-2011, 10:54 AM
Hehehe, I love the term "pie hole" (http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2000/6/23/). It makes me giggle.

Adam
01-29-2011, 12:24 PM
Tanto, you're so spkow!

Karzac
01-30-2011, 08:11 AM
Once the game starts back up tonight, dtsund will be replaced by poetfox.

I do not envy the amount of reading she'll have to do.

poetfox
01-30-2011, 04:06 PM
Holy shit.

Well, uh, I'm caught up anyway.

widdershins
01-30-2011, 04:21 PM
Welcome to the party, pal. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIfNtUttcYk)

JohnB
01-30-2011, 04:30 PM
Welcome to the party, pal. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIfNtUttcYk)

Best Christmas movie ever.

poetfox
01-31-2011, 07:59 AM
I just wrote a sestina about rooting out trolls.

I blame all of you.

Also, man, sestina is a horrible poetic form.

Falselogic
01-31-2011, 02:10 PM
Hey these have been popping up a lot in thread and I have no idea what they mean!

WIFOM

Lampshading

So if you all would be please to explain? Thanks!

Karzac
01-31-2011, 02:16 PM
WIFOM: Wine In Front Of Me: It's a Princess Bride reference and basically involves trying to outthink your opponent by trying to predict their intentions and their actions, using reverse psychology and all that.

I'm not exactly sure what lampshading is, but I think it has to do with distancing yourself from your own ideas.

EDIT: Ninja'd by the GM!

Falselogic
01-31-2011, 02:18 PM
WIFOM is an acronym for "wine in front of me." It's a reference to the famous battle of wits (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQNHBUqfLnM) from The Princess Bride, where Vizzini lays out a dizzying array of second-, third-, fourth-, and fifth-guessing. Its usage in Mafia is generally cautionary against succumbing to analysis paralysis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analysis_paralysis).

Lampshading is the act of acknowledging the dubiousness of an action even while performing it. "I know this seems like something the trolls would suggest, but what if we..." and that sort of thing.

Those are things that are useful to know... Thanks!

McClain
01-31-2011, 06:12 PM
More fun stuff on lampshade hanging! (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LampshadeHanging)

(I don't tend to like linking tvtropes that much, but they have to great examples on this one)

Karzac
01-31-2011, 06:17 PM
I've just decided that if I ever make a formal Mafia pitch that the bad guys are going to be called Motherfuckers.

JohnB
01-31-2011, 07:44 PM
I've just decided that if I ever make a formal Mafia pitch that the bad guys are going to be called Motherfuckers.

You HAVE to let me be evil! Oh my god even if you asshats lynch me day 1 I don't care.

Karzac
02-02-2011, 05:20 PM
Guys, ten percent of my total TT posts have come in this game. That's crazy.

widdershins
02-02-2011, 06:31 PM
Guys, ten percent of my total TT posts have come in this game. That's crazy.

I came to a similar conclusion myself. Scary stuff.

Destil
02-02-2011, 06:36 PM
M2E:143
M3:200
M4UD:139
M5: 71
M6:28
M7L:24
M9:92

So only 697 out of 3528... still a hell of a lot of posts.

Umby
02-02-2011, 07:44 PM
Guys, ten percent of my total TT posts have come in this game. That's crazy.

More like 90% for me, broski.

Brickroad
02-02-2011, 08:12 PM
Yeah, I don't think I've ever seen Umby post in any other threads.

Paul le Fou
02-02-2011, 08:24 PM
Yeah, I don't think I've ever seen Umby post in any other threads.

...huh. You know, I think you're right.

shivam
02-02-2011, 08:25 PM
that's so....strange. he's fucking ubiquitous in the mafia threads.

Karzac
02-02-2011, 08:44 PM
I think I've seen a few posts.

Tanto
02-03-2011, 10:51 AM
...

Day 5
~Posts #1266-1659~

The Day begins with the Citizens discovering that Adam has been killed by the Mafia.

Widdershins begins analyzing the fallout of the previous Day's events. He comes to the conclusion that the Mafia really didn't like the "put Brickroad into the medium" plan, enough so that they'd risk standing out in the crowd in order to shout it down. He notes that this makes Karzac look pretty bad (as he jumped ship from the nay voters once it became evident that the "nays" didn't have enough traction to win) and concludes by revealing that he, rather than Brickroad, was placed in the medium last Night. This means that either a Citizen ignored the plan, Brickroad lied about not being in the medium, or Brickroad lied about not being a Mafioso, none of which are particularly comforting for the Town. (Winter adds that the Mafia might have picked someone who was already in the medium, with the resultant random selection going widdershins's way.) However, widdershins notes that if he's reading the titles right, the newly-activated power is the Bomb, which means he can safely reveal himself. JohnB buys into widdershins's argument, and reveals: He is the Bomb, and Destil was the player who ignored the plan and put widdershins into the medium. Shivam confirms that JohnB is in the medium, because he (shivam) was the one who put him there.

Winter points out that Destil was one of the original anti-Brickroad-plan voters, so he may have been trusting in his own judgment rather than the wisdom of crowds. Brickroad requests a Destil digest, and poetfox (nee dtsund) complies. Poetfox comes to the conclusion that Destil could be a Mafioso, and votes for him.

Winter analyzes the voting patterns, particularly the course of events surrounding the battle between Yimothy (confirmed innocent) and Nodal (confirmed guilty) in the waning hours of Day 1. She argues that Wheels comes across the worst as a result of this (he was consistently on Nodal's side throughout, and tried to disparage people who voted for him).

Paul le Fou and shivam like Destil as a Mafioso; as his voting patterns have been suspicious, particularly backing off a Nodal vote when Nodal was in real danger and attacking confirmed Citizens like Byron for flimsy reasons. Paul le Fou also notes that Wheels has been a bandwagoneer throughout, and his close association with Nodal doesn't do him any favors.

Destil steps in and claims that he, too is a Bomb, and that he chose Adam the previous night in order to force another Citizen to be chosen (giving the Town another confirmed Citizen). He also claims that he was trying to get himself into the server, then bait the Mafia into killing him. Phantoon criticizes Destil's actions, saying that even if he was on the up-and-up it wasn't the smartest thing to do. Widdershins agrees that Destil's strategy has massive holes, and is in fact so bad that it stinks of intentional obfuscation. With that in mind, widdershins votes Destil. Winter agrees that Destil is probably dirty, but suggests leaving him alive for a Day in order to force the Mafia's hand. Widdershins and Karzac don't like it, but Destil obviously does, arguing that it could be used to build a voting bloc, a strategy that hasn't been viable since M2.

Brickroad and JohnB yell at SDMX for non-participation.

There's some long-winded dissection of the server chain and the mechanics of the Bomb role. Destil volunteers to vote for himself to prove the veracity of his story.

Both the Destil and SDMX arguments run in circles for a while. Destil insists that his plan was better than what widdershins had come up with, but Winter and Karzac argue vehemently against him, and other players pipe up as well.

Umby tries to start an investigation of fanboymaster.

Widdershins tries once again to fiddle with the voting order in order to manipulate the Bomb target.

Paul le Fou speaks in defense of Destil, pointing out that the voting for widdershins's plan on Day 4 was neither as unanimous nor as binding as widdershins is making it out to be. He also notes that Brickroad has very conspicuously stood clear of the entire Destil debate.

Destil proposes a title-revealing/bloc-building plan, and tries to entice Brickroad into buying in. Brickroad likes the idea of a bloc, but fears he may be biased on that account, and trawls for opinions. Paul le Fou doesn't like the plan, though, claiming it would be to difficult to get off the ground and too vulnerable while it was doing so. Surprisingly, however, widdershins approves the plan, and puts it (sigh) to another vote.

SDMX argues that Brickroad has been shielding fanboymaster, while also being instrumental in the death of three innocents, and also points the finger at spineshark and Wheels. Brickroad (much later) votes for fanboymaster just to head off this speculation.

Widdershins and Destil put their heads together and hammer out the details of the new bloc strategy. It seems to earn widespread support, with the notable exceptions of kaisel and Winter. With that finally settled (more or less, and barring a few revisions) the conversation turns to who should be killed next.

Phantoon aims for Winter, while also giving kaisel the stink-eye. Kaisel, perhaps looking to get into Phantoon's good graces, votes for Winter. JohnB, meanwhile, votes for Wheels, while Brickroad defends him. Widdershins likes poetfox. It's basically a giant clusterfuck, is the takeaway here. Eventually consensus seems to settle on Wheels, who is lynched and revealed to be innocent.

spineshark
02-03-2011, 10:52 AM
I didn't have internet for like 9 hours yesterday. So that was sweet.

namelessentity
02-03-2011, 11:16 AM
Wow that was a crazy day.

Tock
02-03-2011, 01:06 PM
It's basically a giant clusterfuck, is the takeaway here.

This could pretty much be the summary for every single day.

Umby
02-03-2011, 01:06 PM
...huh. You know, I think you're right.

You have the Diplomacy thread I help run, and I make a few comments on various boards, but by and by I feel more of a lurker otherwise. Haven't broken the habit yet. However, I have posted in other places, of course.

Paul le Fou
02-03-2011, 08:26 PM
You have the Diplomacy thread I help run, and I make a few comments on various boards, but by and by I feel more of a lurker otherwise. Haven't broken the habit yet. However, I have posted in other places, of course.

Making the bare minimum number of posts to appear as though you're participating in the forum, but flying under the radar of most posters... a few threads to make ti seem like you're helping but contributing little to the whole of the forum...

I accuse Umby

Javex
02-03-2011, 08:29 PM
I am really enjoying the spectator portion of this game. Nich, great job so far with a really fun concept and a good group.

I wish I had more time, so I could partake!

Umby
02-03-2011, 08:41 PM
Making the bare minimum number of posts to appear as though you're participating in the forum, but flying under the radar of most posters... a few threads to make ti seem like you're helping but contributing little to the whole of the forum...

I accuse Umby

Paul le Fou, you know you're just hating on me because I'm easy to hate. I accuse Paul le Fou of being dumb. Just kidding.

Karzac
02-03-2011, 08:44 PM
Oh my God: the Umby Cycle has gone Meta!

Brickroad
02-04-2011, 09:22 AM
Oh my God: the Umby Cycle has gone Meta!

You might even say...

double meta.

:cool:

Dizzy
02-04-2011, 09:35 AM
You might even say...

double meta.

>.>

double mtae.

double mate.

double maet.

double meat.

double meat.

OOOOHHH!

JohnB
02-04-2011, 10:59 AM
http://funboxcomedy.com/uploaded_images/Head-explodes-big-761152.jpg

Falselogic
02-04-2011, 11:01 AM
http://funboxcomedy.com/uploaded_images/Head-explodes-big-761152.jpg

Aw come on JohnB I'm eating my lunch here man!

JohnB
02-04-2011, 11:14 AM
It's not my fault Dizzy caused the universe to explode!

Falselogic
02-04-2011, 01:59 PM
By the way, I regret to say that since I'll be out of town during much of Act 6, I probably won't be able to provide the regular, punctual vote tallies you're accustomed to. Sorry!

TALCONNNNNNNNN!!!!!!

Adam
02-04-2011, 03:04 PM
TAL KAHHHHHNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!

Falselogic
02-04-2011, 03:13 PM
TAL KAHHHHHNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRnSnfiUI54)

Funny thing was I thought of linking it after making that original post... Fixed now though.

SDMX
02-04-2011, 06:13 PM
Talcon notoriously ruins the lives of everyone who is not going to Talcon.

Falselogic
02-04-2011, 11:00 PM
It's going to kill the mafia thread too. Or just kill those of us who won't be able to follow it or post because we will be driving to, attending, or returning from, Talcon.

widdershins
02-05-2011, 12:11 AM
It's a weekend anyway, conversation always dies down when one or both of the days falls on a weekend.

I'll be sure to make another hundred longwinded posts, though. Just out of spite, really -- I'm sad I'm not there with you guys.

Adam
02-05-2011, 12:38 AM
I love the delicious tears that are being shed because 3 whole players are going to be absent for a day.

Okay, 2. CAN'T WAIT TO MEET YOU SDMX

Phantoon
02-05-2011, 02:04 PM
http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/tt161/Phantoon/supermetroidphantoonexploding.gif

Bollocks.

Champagne Room, please!

JohnB
02-05-2011, 04:56 PM
Okay, for the rest of us plebes what in the fuck is talcon?

Nodal
02-05-2011, 05:03 PM
Okay, for the rest of us plebes what in the fuck is talcon?

Shivam's party.

SDMX
02-06-2011, 12:58 AM
Christ, I know all mafia threads get all cutthroat and assholish, but this one seems to be especially so. It's literally become the anti-TT for me.

shivam
02-06-2011, 01:19 AM
Okay, for the rest of us plebes what in the fuck is talcon?

my birthday party/gaming convention. we had live action mafia hosted by Nich and some of my other friends. it was fun!

Brickroad
02-06-2011, 04:21 AM
I can't help but notice I wasn't invited to Talcon

Is it because I love cheeseburgers, shivam? You can tell me if it's because of cheeseburgers. I can *sniff* handle it.

JohnB
02-06-2011, 05:32 AM
my birthday party/gaming convention. we had live action mafia hosted by Nich and some of my other friends. it was fun!

That... that is so awesome. Holy shit. Congrats, man!

Merus
02-06-2011, 06:06 AM
I can't help but notice I wasn't invited to Talcon

Is it because I love cheeseburgers, shivam? You can tell me if it's because of cheeseburgers. I can *sniff* handle it.

I imagine it has something to do with you treating going to the other side of the country as if it's going to Mars.

Brickroad
02-06-2011, 03:45 PM
I imagine it has something to do with you treating going to the other side of the country as if it's going to Mars.

It's about as expensive!

Falselogic
02-07-2011, 10:37 AM
I have to say guys/gals after participating in real-life mafia at Talcon coming back to the forum version is kind of a let down.

widdershins
02-07-2011, 10:52 AM
Nice to see you too?

Dizzy
02-07-2011, 10:54 AM
Christ, I know all mafia threads get all cutthroat and assholish, but this one seems to be especially so. It's literally become the anti-TT for me.

It's your fault you don't use these games to puff your chest and bark at people with a confidence you direly lack in real life.

Maybe we can have a Dating Sim-themed Mafia and then things can get really sexy. (And hopeless.)

Falselogic
02-07-2011, 10:58 AM
Nice to see you too?

Ha, you too Widdershins! Thank goodness Luana was at Talcon so that I could use her phone to read your latest broadside in-thread.

Just very different beasts. My preference is the simple, quick, way real-life plays out. Opposed to the forum one. Both have been fun though.

widdershins
02-07-2011, 11:18 AM
This may have not been the ideal first game for you then. 26 players is quite large even by our standards, and most games would be close to complete at this point.

EDIT: Not to mention with a much smaller post count. My own verbal diarrhea notwithstanding.

JohnB
02-07-2011, 12:18 PM
Maybe we can have a Dating Sim-themed Mafia and then things can get really sexy. (And hopeless.)

I think it's awesome that I didn't see that last word as hopeless, but topless.

widdershins
02-07-2011, 02:24 PM
Damn, that was chilling.

SDMX
02-07-2011, 02:28 PM
When it comes to flavor text that truly puts an absolutely crippling squeeze of regret and/or fear into your heart, Nich reigns supreme.

Falselogic
02-07-2011, 02:29 PM
Well that was the first bit of Nich mafia fiction that I found disturbing...

Sorry Poetfox!

Eddie
02-07-2011, 02:32 PM
Gotta say, you guys are real jerks!

Also: once again, voting for yourself is still not a viable strategy for living!

- Eddie

shivam
02-07-2011, 03:02 PM
dude, that's fucked up.

kaisel
02-07-2011, 03:04 PM
Well that was the first bit of Nich mafia fiction that I found disturbing...

Sorry Poetfox!

The crucified guy in Gemini/Libra was disturbing to me. But yeah, good job on creeping us out Nich.

Falselogic
02-07-2011, 03:04 PM
The crucified guy in Gemini/Libra was disturbing to me. But yeah, good job on creeping us out Nich.

Seeing as this is my first game. I wouldn't have knowledge of that so...

shivam
02-07-2011, 03:06 PM
yeah, sdmx was crucified in space, and i was burned at the stake in that game.

personally i like the death scenes in M6, but i'm biased =)

botticus
02-07-2011, 04:00 PM
My alter ego is kind of a jerk.

Brickroad
02-07-2011, 05:24 PM
I hope the endless one-upmanship of grisly death scenes becomes a Mafia staple.

McClain
02-07-2011, 05:54 PM
I hope the endless one-upmanship of grisly death scenes becomes a Mafia staple.

Then I'll remind you that my pitch involves something called a Charyou Tree. :cool:

shivam
02-07-2011, 05:55 PM
McClain's mafia pitch- This time you fucks CAN'T kill me!
pinky smile

McClain
02-07-2011, 05:59 PM
McClain's mafia pitch- This time you fucks CAN'T kill me!
pinky smile

Spoiler! I fully intend to still be the first person to die in my own game.

Adam
02-07-2011, 11:12 PM
Spoiler! I fully intend to still be the first person to die in my own game.

Spoiler! He's already dead.

Tanto
02-08-2011, 11:55 AM
Day 6
~Posts #1663-1835~

The Day begins with Phantoon falling victim to the Mafia's predations.

Widdershins says that Phantoon was the Mafia's only real option for slowing the growth of a voting bloc, and suggests looking into poetfox, botticus, and Rai (formerly fanboymaster). Destil calls for full handle reveals in order to cut off any potential Mafia fronting actions. Widdershins says that people should only reveal if they feel comfortable doing so, and accuses poetfox. Poetfox, in turn, tries to splash mud on Destil's planning. Destil likes SDMX instead, claiming that he's being intentionally misleading.

Widdershins frets about the potential havoc the Swapper power could wreak.

JohnB emphasizes that if the confirmed Citizens don't vote in a bloc, the Town doesn't in any real sense have a bloc, and suggests that he, shivam, Destil, and widdershins all get behind one target, suggesting SDMX as the potential target. Karzac also jumps on SDMX, claiming the latter is specifically playing in such a way that he leaves as small a trail as possible (and is thus never a pressing lynch target).

Widdershins makes the poetfox case. Karzac concedes that it's a convincing one, but notes discomfort with the idea that a Mafioso would quit the game. Brickroad says that this has happened before, and more importantly, if you're going to stop yourself from killing poetfox over that, you'll never catch her if she is indeed dirty. Despite, this, however, he votes for SDMX.

SDMX whines about being unfairly persecuted, and votes for Brickroad. Paul le Fou worries about botticus, spineshark, SDMX, and JohnB, but ends up voting Brickroad anyway. Brickroad amuses himself by baiting... well, basically everyone.

Widdershins calls upon the Hermit of Ascent to reveal themselves. Karzac eventually takes him up on it, and claims the title and the role of Revenant.

SDMX reveals himself as a potential Vigilante (he's not in the medium yet), warding off several votes. Most of them fall on poetfox instead. Poetfox votes for herself for some reason. (Like turning yourself into a snake, this never helps.)

Destil performs maths and comes to the conclusion that the Citizens have basically already won and just need to play out the string with nothing unsuspecting happening.

Paul le Fou compiles the claimed handles, and he and widdershins debate what this means with regards to Mafia-hunting, but don't come to any solid conclusions. Which can also be said for every other post in the last real-time day of the Day, I guess, because it's mostly filler and running down the clock. Poetfox is lynched, and is innocent.

Falselogic
02-08-2011, 01:36 PM
he forgot to mention all the jokes at the end.

widdershins
02-08-2011, 02:08 PM
Fun fact: My post count is just barely below the combined post count of the #2 and #3 posters.

I need a life so bad.

Brickroad
02-08-2011, 08:19 PM
So here's my idea for M10: no town roles, large mafia of unknown quantity, standard rules otherwise.

The catch: each mobster has a unique voting quirk he must follow. For example, "You must change your vote once, and only once." This mobster would have to make and then change his vote every day.

Analyzing voting patterns is something the town always does anyway, usually for little or no gain. Figured we might as well have a game built around that core concept.

Karzac
02-08-2011, 08:39 PM
So here's my idea for M10: no town roles, large mafia of unknown quantity, standard rules otherwise.

The catch: each mobster has a unique voting quirk he must follow. For example, "You must change your vote once, and only once." This mobster would have to make and then change his vote every day.

Analyzing voting patterns is something the town always does anyway, usually for little or no gain. Figured we might as well have a game built around that core concept.

I like that idea a lot. There could also be stuff like "you must vote for the person who voted for you" or "you must vote with the majority."

You could do some cool stuff with it.

kaisel
02-08-2011, 09:25 PM
So here's my idea for M10: no town roles, large mafia of unknown quantity, standard rules otherwise.

The catch: each mobster has a unique voting quirk he must follow. For example, "You must change your vote once, and only once." This mobster would have to make and then change his vote every day.

Analyzing voting patterns is something the town always does anyway, usually for little or no gain. Figured we might as well have a game built around that core concept.

I like it, as I want a game like that. Though I'm going to pitch my "get kills in exchange for eliminating targets", as I fear that it'll either be too difficult to discern voting quirks, or too easy.

Brickroad
02-08-2011, 09:38 PM
My main concern is how to handle the eventuality of a townie saying, "Okay, if you're clean, change your vote to x and prove it!"

A sufficiently motivated town could find every single mobster in one day doing that.

Ideas?

kaisel
02-08-2011, 09:52 PM
My main concern is how to handle the eventuality of a townie saying, "Okay, if you're clean, change your vote to x and prove it!"

A sufficiently motivated town could find every single mobster in one day doing that.

Ideas?

Hrm, you could modify it so that instead of the mob having to stick to their voting patterns, instead they get some sort of bonus if they all conform. Like a night kill if they pull it off. Or give some players powers, and if they conform to their voting patterns then the players can't use their powers. Both have the issue of gaining information should one of those things not happen, as in, if they have a night kill, then you know what days to investigate for voting patterns.

Maybe a reward to help, but not give too much of a bonus, like if they all follow their voting patterns, then they get to talk during the next day phase or something?

shivam
02-08-2011, 09:55 PM
it would suck being a townie in that game.

Brickroad
02-08-2011, 09:59 PM
it would suck being a townie in that game.

It already sucks being a townie in every game.

spineshark
02-08-2011, 10:24 PM
I'm all for this concept, as long as Brick gets modkilled if he doesn't whine enough.

Destil
02-08-2011, 10:52 PM
It already sucks being a townie in every game.

I seem to be enjoying it (not that the dice have ever given me any other option ;) ).

Alpha Werewolf
02-08-2011, 11:08 PM
What I'm planning for M10: Mao mafia (no rules given, apart for your role PM) where every player has a posting restriction (think "replace all your e's with 3's", but way crazier).

shivam
02-08-2011, 11:14 PM
m10 should be classic original rules, remember?

Garrison
02-08-2011, 11:16 PM
classic rules were horribly unbalanced.

Destil
02-08-2011, 11:23 PM
I'm pretty sure anniversary mafia (with some balance corrections) is going to win. I'm voting for it, for one.

But, man, I have a really great pitch I need to shine up. The basic concept's been rattling around my brain since M1...

Brickroad
02-08-2011, 11:33 PM
Okay, I won't bother pitching anything then.

Paul le Fou
02-09-2011, 12:01 AM
m10 should be classic original rules, remember?

Yeah we stopped using those rules for a reason. (The reason was that they were bad.) I sure as hell won't be voting for it.

I'm working on my own infant pitch from last time slowly but surely. I think it's got some neat stuff.


Brick's idea is pretty interesting. Giving the town/mafia something they can actually, you know, hunt for, but have to sort out from actual information... it's kind of like our current game, but way less susceptible to skillful full-face lying and random stabs in the dark.

You'd have to be careful to design the mafia's tells, though. If one guy switches his vote to three different players when there's a bandwagon in effect on someone, or won't vote at all even when called on directly to do so, it'll be too easy to catch them out, kind of like you said. Possibly some longer-scale ones, like "can never vote for the same person twice (until all players have been voted for)."

That said, I can think of something already to break it apart - townies pick one voting strategy not likely to be assigned to the mafia ("change your vote five times.") Everyone who can does, everyone else is the mafia.

If you had more lenient/puzzly voting patterns - like, voting for certain people from the main player list (Have to move up/down the list from a certain starting point, or every second person) or only voting for people with A in their name... it might be harder to find them, but it might also get so obscured that we're ultimately left thrashing in the dark with as little or less to go on than we had in any other game.

JohnB
02-09-2011, 03:25 AM
classic rules were horribly unbalanced.

I have to agree. It's a nice idea in theory, the "anniversary" and all that, but I dunno how fun it'd be to play.

JohnB
02-09-2011, 03:35 AM
That said, I can think of something already to break it apart - townies pick one voting strategy not likely to be assigned to the mafia ("change your vote five times.") Everyone who can does, everyone else is the mafia.

I like the idea, Brick, but I think this breaks the game open and it'd be hard to plan for every contigency of some bullshit or other like it.

PS - I still really like your other pitch, though. Who gives a fuck if it's compicated? M9 is complex, and M9 is awesome! I'd rather play that game if you're willing to propose it. I won't be voting anniversary.

botticus
02-09-2011, 06:07 AM
My main concern is how to handle the eventuality of a townie saying, "Okay, if you're clean, change your vote to x and prove it!"

A sufficiently motivated town could find every single mobster in one day doing that.

Ideas?

How about the mafia voting rules applying to their final vote? For example, the "must vote with the majority" rule means at the end of the day, they have to be voting with the majority, but they could have changed their vote any number of times before then. The only issue I see immediately would be what happens if I'm that guy, and I'm not around at the end of the day to react to a 5 vote swing that leaves me voting against the majority. Penalties? Heck, maybe the town gets a public inspection every day after a rule is broken.

There are probably still ways to potentially break it, but making it more fluid would give the mafia more places to hide, but also make the 72 hours of town analysis more engaging.

Obviously with no town roles, you can't make it impossible for the mafia to be sniffed out, so there will probably be some easier to identify than others.

namelessentity
02-09-2011, 08:38 AM
I think we messed around with giving the town tangible information back during the M5 vote, and the consensus then was it would just be turning mafia less about lies, deceit, paranoia, and the deduction that wins overall and more about solving one big logic puzzle. I have mixed feelings about this, because I love the paranoia, but would really like some tangible logic that I could use.

To go to the logic extreme, I would like to see a game were each player is given like six attributes (hair color, eye color, height, etc), and each night there is a witness to the mob attack. That witness would be given one attribute about a random mob member. He can choose to reveal the information or hold on to it privately, using it to slowly whittle down suspects.

I think it gives a nice detective aspect without being too overpowered.

Alpha Werewolf
02-09-2011, 10:22 AM
To go to the logic extreme, I would like to see a game were each player is given like six attributes (hair color, eye color, height, etc), and each night there is a witness to the mob attack. That witness would be given one attribute about a random mob member. He can choose to reveal the information or hold on to it privately, using it to slowly whittle down suspects.

I think it gives a nice detective aspect without being too overpowered.

Originally, before Merus had agreed to do totally awesome flavor for M8, I planned to make very rough flavor pertaining to the mafia and serial killer kills. For example, whenever Ryu made a kill, the dead person would be listed as X: Killed by a burning hole in his stomach.

I personally dislike the vote restrictions, unless everyone has them.

Eddie
02-09-2011, 10:42 AM
I like the idea of no powers, but having mafia have some sort of restriction that could give them a 'tell.' Of course, implementing that would be easier said than done.

Ideally I think I'd want a game with very few powers that relies on wit and intuition to solve, but the fact remains that Internet makes it very hard to read people.

One solution might be a survivor-style set-up where private communication is allowed. There are no night kills, instead killing one player every day until either all the 'mafia' are killed or they form a majority. The idea would be (hopefully) that players are encouraged to join secret alliances, with the hope that promises will be made, broken, and etc. etc.

- Eddie

Merus
02-09-2011, 02:01 PM
The reason I felt M4 worked so well (was it that long ago?) was the deduction aspect that emerged. People's behaviours changed when they got converted, and they couldn't always hide it; if you knew what you were looking for, you could work out where people flipped, and build up a sequence of events from there.

shivam
02-09-2011, 02:09 PM
maybe it is time for another thing game, huh?

Brickroad
02-09-2011, 02:14 PM
The only way I would enjoy playing The Thing 2 is if I got to be the original The Thing. That's not very likely, though, and there's next to zero chance I would ever get converted. I would sit that one out.

The best idea I could come up with to solve the "voting quirks" problem was to have a rule stating, "If challenged, you may cast or change your vote in order to maintain your cover, even if it means breaking your rule. You may sit on that vote as long as you like, even to the end of the day, but your next vote must again confirm to your quirk."

Making GM judgments on something that subjective would be a nightmare, but perhaps simply having the rule in place would be enough of a chilling effect that the town wouldn't try it. (What would it gain them, anyway?)

SDMX
02-09-2011, 02:17 PM
Time to sip on some bubbly, I suppose. Is there one of them rooms this round?

namelessentity
02-09-2011, 02:40 PM
Making GM judgments on something that subjective would be a nightmare, but perhaps simply having the rule in place would be enough of a chilling effect that the town wouldn't try it. (What would it gain them, anyway?)

The fun of making the GM do extra work, and the adrenaline rush that comes with the divine retribution that knocks you out of the game when you do it.

The reason I felt M4 worked so well (was it that long ago?) was the deduction aspect that emerged. People's behaviours changed when they got converted, and they couldn't always hide it; if you knew what you were looking for, you could work out where people flipped, and build up a sequence of events from there.

While playing I totally agreed with this, but I remember almost all of our deductions being completely wrong when revealed in the post game chat. Still, if someone wants to put up Thing II, I'd vote for it.

Merus
02-09-2011, 03:01 PM
While playing I totally agreed with this, but I remember almost all of our deductions being completely wrong when revealed in the post game chat. Still, if someone wants to put up Thing II, I'd vote for it.

Yeah, but this is part of the game; once you start making accurate deductions, the Things are finished.

McClain
02-09-2011, 03:12 PM
I would be all about playing the Thing again any time.

namelessentity
02-09-2011, 04:30 PM
I would be all about playing the Thing again any time.

You're only saying that because it is nearly impossible to kill you on the first night.

widdershins
02-09-2011, 05:12 PM
I'd just like to take this opportunity to apologize to everyone in this game. I've been trying to be more aggressive this time 'round, but feel terrible every time I'm a dick to someone (which is just about all of you at this point).

Cheers.

kaisel
02-09-2011, 05:13 PM
I'd just like to take this opportunity to apologize to everyone in this game. I've been trying to be more aggressive this time 'round, but feel terrible every time I'm a dick to someone (which is just about all of you at this point).

Cheers.


I think everyone ends up apologizing about this, it's just the nature of the game. I think we're all mature enough to realize that what happens in the game, stays in the game.

Destil
02-09-2011, 05:30 PM
I don't. Calling everyone stupid when I thought I was going to die was half the fun.

Brickroad
02-09-2011, 05:46 PM
I think everyone ends up apologizing about this, it's just the nature of the game. I think we're all mature enough to realize that what happens in the game, stays in the game.

sp3ak for yours3lf asshol3!! :3

kaisel
02-09-2011, 05:47 PM
I don't. Calling everyone stupid when I thought I was going to die was half the fun.

sp3ak for yours3lf asshol3!! :3

All the cool kids at least, jerk.

Actually, I almost tossed out a "except Brickroad" exception, but figured that it was just unspoken knowledge.

McClain
02-10-2011, 09:00 AM
You're only saying that because it is nearly impossible to kill you on the first night.

While this is very, very true, I also liked The Thing because it's the only game we've played so far where you really get to look for a change in behavior in game, instead of all the normal meta bullshit. That was so much fun, you guys. So much fun.

Umby
02-10-2011, 05:54 PM
I'm inclined to agree. The Thing, which I thought would be dumb in the beginning, not only was my best game, but also my favorite game because there was always more information to go on (in the Upper Deck, anyway) and we were able to work as a team to win. And I can imagine being the Thing has to be fun, too.

Brickroad
02-10-2011, 06:01 PM
While this is very, very true, I also liked The Thing because it's the only game we've played so far where you really get to look for a change in behavior in game, instead of all the normal meta bullshit. That was so much fun, you guys. So much fun.

Yeah, fun if you're good at that sort of thing.

I'm not.

Hence, The Thing = zero fun.

Would not vote for or play The Thing 2. Not saying it shouldn't get played, just saying it's not my cup of tea.

Nodal
02-10-2011, 06:48 PM
I wouldn't vote for a The Thing again.

Karzac
02-10-2011, 07:01 PM
The Thing sounds pretty cool and I might vote for it. I'll still like to try Brick's game too, though.

I may not have the time to play M10 though. School's getting pretty busy.

Nodal
02-10-2011, 07:21 PM
Oh, that reminds me. Can we make it a rule where if you vote for a game, you have to play in it. Because people voting for lame rulesets that would be "Fun to watch" is super weak.

McClain
02-10-2011, 09:09 PM
Oh, that reminds me. Can we make it a rule where if you vote for a game, you have to play in it. Because people voting for lame rulesets that would be "Fun to watch" is super weak.

I will back this 100%. In fact, I would say that, unexpected life events aside, voting for a game IS signing up for it. Go ahead and put down those folks to start the players list.

Brickroad
02-10-2011, 09:11 PM
Oh, that reminds me. Can we make it a rule where if you vote for a game, you have to play in it. Because people voting for lame rulesets that would be "Fun to watch" is super weak.

There are a few times where I felt the eventual winner wouldn't have won if not for all the people that were just voting for everything.

McClain
02-10-2011, 09:37 PM
There are a few times where I felt the eventual winner wouldn't have won if not for all the people that were just voting for everything.

Well, if you want to play all equally...

Though it's really the same as just not voting.