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Merus
02-22-2010, 03:20 AM
I gotta agree with Silent Noise about not changing the vote setup. The current way is certainly a little more time consuming, but it allows for more focused discussion. Just having everyone blather off a name (or list of names) of people that they'd like to string up and tallying it up is pretty 'eh' to me, and in a game that can already can chaotic, there's simply too much that could slip through the cracks if everyone's having at it with everyone they want to lynch and why, people rebutting, ect. The "trial" system feels a lot more appropriate and structured.

I don't think this is a risk: you can only vote for one name at a time, and changing votes is enough of a suspicious action (you have to pick someone else to target, which will raise their ire) that I imagine only a few people will ping-pong. I also think that it lessens the impact of timezones, because the game can't be locked into a trial while others are sleeping, so you can always propose other players to look at.

Besides, the extra chaos is entirely part of the plan. I felt like it was too difficult for the mafia to get any influence on the game, although we now know that they didn't really try to; conversely, I felt like voting patterns didn't really end up meaning much, which is what made Brickroad's leadership so important.

I think the trial is a good system for real-world mafia, because as you said it's less chaotic, but in a forum conversations don't usually devolve into pure chaos because of the way forums work. I think we'll be fine.

I'm agreeing with the people that don't really want to see the formula change too much for the second game; we're learning how to play the game, and I think we have to be sensitive about making change for change's sake. At the moment, I'm thinking we should save the Mediums and Spirits for a future game - they change strategies and behaviours much more than I'm comfortable with so early in the game's history here. There's an overwhelming consensus for the Vigilante being guilty and removing the Miller, so I think whoever ends up Narrator should keep that in mind. I think the voting system change is worth trying, and keeping in mind that it's likely to increase chaos, I think that any other changes intended to increase chaos should be saved until we're more adept at the game.

Brickroad
02-22-2010, 03:46 AM
Complete list of changes I'd like to see in Round 2:

- Miller and Vigilante roles merged.
- Merus-style daytime voting.
- Six mobsters instead of five.

I feel like the citizens made a lot of fantastically stupid moves, and the mob didn't really. The mob should have gotten closer to winning than they did, given the moves they made. dtsund says it's because "they didn't get lucky", but I don't want to play a game where only lucky mobsters get to win.

Paul le Fou
02-22-2010, 03:54 AM
- Miller and Vigilante roles merged.
- Merus-style daytime voting.

I definitely want to try these for a round.

-Six mobsters instead of five.

This I figure should wait until we see exactly how many people we have playing. A number of people said they wanted in this round, but others have mentioned that they might or will duck out. If we're losing people overall we don't want to increase the number of mafia because the lower pop is already a move in their favor. If it stays the same or increases I'd definitely support an increase to six though.

Tanto
02-22-2010, 08:58 AM
I'm interested in this, but I'm not sure how good I'd be. I'll think I'll watch another round (paying closer attention this time), and then go from there.

kaisel
02-22-2010, 09:07 AM
I'm interested in this, but I'm not sure how good I'd be. I'll think I'll watch another round (paying closer attention this time), and then go from there.

You should just join in, a larger group will have an interesting dynamic, and a good portion of the people who will probably be playing are also new to the game. It's really hard for one person to totally screw over their side, mafia or citizen, since it's so collaborative.

Phantoon
02-22-2010, 09:08 AM
I'm interested in this, but I'm not sure how good I'd be. I'll think I'll watch another round (paying closer attention this time), and then go from there.

Join us. You couldn't possibly be any more rubbish than we were.

Traumadore
02-22-2010, 09:53 AM
Is this where I say I'm in? Because I was away when this all started, but I am a Werewolf fiend.

vaterite
02-22-2010, 11:22 AM
Here's the downside I see to merging the Vigilante and the Miller. If you're accussed it's a little too easy to prove that you're the Vigilante by offing someone. Wheras it is completely impossible to prove you're the Miller.

Also, I think there may have been a little too much discussion about the game in this thread while the game was going on. As a mafia player, it was kind of uncomfortable to watch this parallel discussion and not feel like I could participate. Any way to limit that?

PapillonReel
02-22-2010, 11:29 AM
Join us. You couldn't possibly be any more rubbish than we were.

Yeah, srsly. I'm surprised you guys didn't lynch me yourselves after blundering through most of the game. :/

kaisel
02-22-2010, 11:31 AM
Out of curiosity, would it hurt to let the mafia have a 24 hour period before the game starts to confer and talk strategy? I think that might make up for the slight (perceived?) disadvantage that the mafia has if we keep the same proportions.

Here's the downside I see to merging the Vigilante and the Miller. If you're accussed it's a little too easy to prove that you're the Vigilante by offing someone. Wheras it is completely impossible to prove you're the Miller.

Also, I think there may have been a little too much discussion about the game in this thread while the game was going on. As a mafia player, it was kind of uncomfortable to watch this parallel discussion and not feel like I could participate. Any way to limit that?

I second both of these actually, I wouldn't mind if the vigilante showed up as guilty in addition to the miller, but that might be a little too much out of scope.

And the parallel discussion was a little difficult, especially with the discussion about night moving to only 24 hours. It was pretty much impossible for the mafia to say why that was a bad idea, without exposing themselves, and also some of the discussion in this thread had some ramifications on the game (the talk of the boring game, and just some of the random comments that were sort of on the line between "night discussion and not"). Luckily, these are easy fixes, if someone is bored/has issues with the game, just PM the narrator, instead of posting in the thread.

Also, I'm very glad for the clarification of not checking who's online. I didn't realize you could see who was sending PMs at the start, but I was very careful to not log in when reading the mafia thread during night phases when it was in that iffy grey area.

SuperRube
02-22-2010, 11:32 AM
Man, I've been so addicted to this thread since it started that I feel I can't not attempt to sign up for the next round. No idea how good I'd be at it, (probably horrible!)

If we're voting on how the next game is set up, I vote for whatever gets the next game started the fastest.

Comb Stranger
02-22-2010, 11:41 AM
A 24 hour delay for the Mafia would be kind of pointless; no one is dumb enough to out themselves on the first day, and unless everyone completely changes their mind about play styles, no one will be lynching day 1 either. The game doesn't start fo' rizzle until the first shots that night.

Garrison
02-22-2010, 12:00 PM
As an observer of the first game, I think the day/night was just fine the way it was. With everyone spread around the world, having the longer cycles is the only feasible way the group can come to a reasonable consensus. The guys in the Mafia kind of need time to hatch out their nightly decisions. Between real life and possible time differences, the game could potentially be impaired by switching to a 24 hour night.

I don't really like the idea of giving the Mafia 24 hours in advance for strategy. When I read through Game 1, I got the impression that day 1 was just for feeling everyone out. I mean, yeah, they can make their strategy early, but it's more than likely going to change when they see someone spreading paranoia or something like that.

But what do I know, I've never played the game before.

Also, if no one minds, I'd love to play along in this upcoming round once the Narrator issue is resolved.

Rai
02-22-2010, 12:14 PM
I'm all for next game, even if I sucked it up last time. Maybe my goal will be to not survive.

Anyway, an easy thing around the whole limit to CC pms would be to use actual e-mail addresses. Worst comes to worst, something special could be set up. I'm not entirely sure that the mafia is as disadvantaged as they can be though.

The Miller just seems like a waste of time though. Sure, it's the only way to absolutely know that the Investigator is telling the truth short of lynching another role, but that's the thing, you have to lynch someone else to verify. The most it does is extend the game with an additional fancy name. Combining it with the Vigilante gives the Vigilante a slightly harder time of it, which could prove interesting.

Phantoon
02-22-2010, 12:31 PM
I think the point of the Miller is more to give the Mafia more of a fighting chance (and to pile on the paranoia) than simply by giving them more members. It's a bit hit and miss though. As I love paranoia I don't particularly object to the idea of a powerless Miller.

kaisel
02-22-2010, 12:38 PM
A 24 hour delay for the Mafia would be kind of pointless; no one is dumb enough to out themselves on the first day, and unless everyone completely changes their mind about play styles, no one will be lynching day 1 either. The game doesn't start fo' rizzle until the first shots that night.

As an observer of the first game, I think the day/night was just fine the way it was. With everyone spread around the world, having the longer cycles is the only feasible way the group can come to a reasonable consensus. The guys in the Mafia kind of need time to hatch out their nightly decisions. Between real life and possible time differences, the game could potentially be impaired by switching to a 24 hour night.

I don't really like the idea of giving the Mafia 24 hours in advance for strategy. When I read through Game 1, I got the impression that day 1 was just for feeling everyone out. I mean, yeah, they can make their strategy early, but it's more than likely going to change when they see someone spreading paranoia or something like that.

But what do I know, I've never played the game before.

Also, if no one minds, I'd love to play along in this upcoming round once the Narrator issue is resolved.

My only problem with this sort of thinking is that it makes it sound like the first day really isn't that important (which I would argue against, the first day is very important), so the game itself might as well start with a mafia/vigilante kill and inspection.

That said, I was just throwing it out there as a small tweak, and I'm glad people are saying what's wrong with the idea, my main reason for thinking about it is that the mafia's biggest advantage is that they can communicate, and setting up a tentative overall strategy could help them, but it seems like it's more trouble than it's worth.

Merus
02-22-2010, 12:41 PM
I feel like the lack of action on Day 1 is a Problem, but then I think there's a real advantage to being able to act without the mafia having coordinated. Maybe there should be an activity check on day 1, so people have to introduce themselves in the thread?

Garrison
02-22-2010, 12:47 PM
I feel like the lack of action on Day 1 is a Problem, but then I think there's a real advantage to being able to act without the mafia having coordinated. Maybe there should be an activity check on day 1, so people have to introduce themselves in the thread?

That sounds like a good idea. Too many people actually just slipped by with nothing but a vote. It's a little hard to get much information out of a simple AYE on day one if the vote unanimous.

Aeonus
02-22-2010, 12:47 PM
Here's the downside I see to merging the Vigilante and the Miller. If you're accussed it's a little too easy to prove that you're the Vigilante by offing someone. Wheras it is completely impossible to prove you're the Miller.

What if everyone just woke up in the day phase with two dead bodies, without any mention of which was the Vigilante's kill and which was the Mafia's? It would not be so trivial to prove you're the Vigilante in that case.

Silent Noise
02-22-2010, 01:08 PM
What if everyone just woke up in the day phase with two dead bodies, without any mention of which was the Vigilante's kill and which was the Mafia's? It would not be so trivial to prove you're the Vigilante in that case.

This sounds like a good idea, besides it doesn't make much sense that we instantly know what role killed who.

Comb Stranger
02-22-2010, 01:38 PM
The Mafia kills people with cement shoes and eagle-bombs, and the vigilante uses a shotgun, silly.

Edit: But I wouldn't mind unlabeled kills, if everyone's for it. It would make it harder on the citizenry aside from the vigilante, in them being less able to deduce the Mafia's strategy. Except when Umby dies, anyway.

Umby
02-22-2010, 03:38 PM
Comb Stranger: :O I have no idea why I was killed by both the mafia and the vigilante. No mafioso would be stupid enough to be that obvious, or would he? And just because I was bloodthirsty... well, in any case, it doesn't matter.

Well, in any case, I want to see more power roles next game. There are a few ways to do this...

The Godfather: He is the main mafioso, and also when checked comes up as innocent.
Extra mafia rule: The mafia do not know who the other mafioso are at the beginning. They get kills = number of mafia/2, rounded up, and those people will be chosen randomly out of the mafia night actions that are received at night. Mafia, strangely enough, can kill mafia.

This can pump up the mafia, and these rules only make sense when you have 30-something people, because the mafia will clear out more than one per day. Also, in this case, two detectives would probably be needed to balance.

Paul le Fou
02-22-2010, 03:58 PM
I don't know about the Godfather - like we saw, the inspector can be pretty powerful even when it doesn't find a single special role at all the entire game. Soon the numbers just come around. Clipping its wings not once but twice might be overkill. Although the godfather idea might be interesting, assuming that the only thing different about him is that he turns up innocent.

However, I have the same problem with the Godfather as I do the Miller - I feel like rules specifically designed to obfuscate information may make the game harder, but they won't make it more fun (and possibly the opposite). Imagine we had our trusted bloc in this game but it turned out Merus was guilty all along because he had pulled the random fuck-you wildcard to show up innocent. It's not that we would have lost or anything, it just would have been infuriating. In a game already fraught with paranoia, a special role designed specifically to increase paranoia... the game is stressful enough already.


Also, I feel like the Vigilante being guilty isn't meaningless just because it's easy to prove. It's useful because if labeled, the vigilante has to come out publicly (or presumably be lynched). That's a big risk, and being forced into the open is a good way to balance out the pretty big power of an extra kill at night. And it's not like having the vigilante public is a dealbreaker, either (as we saw), just a lot more dangerous. That danger is an acceptable counter to the power it brings to the citizens, I think.

Brickroad
02-22-2010, 04:17 PM
However, I have the same problem with the Godfather as I do the Miller - I feel like rules specifically designed to obfuscate information may make the game harder, but they won't make it more fun (and possibly the opposite).

I could not agree more, and this was my main objection with the Miller from the beginning.

For the record, had I was planning to treat the Miller like any other mafioso. It didn't really add any depth to my strategy outside of "I'll need six positives instead of five."

Also, I feel like the Vigilante being guilty isn't meaningless just because it's easy to prove. It's useful because if labeled, the vigilante has to come out publicly (or presumably be lynched). That's a big risk, and being forced into the open is a good way to balance out the pretty big power of an extra kill at night. And it's not like having the vigilante public is a dealbreaker, either (as we saw), just a lot more dangerous. That danger is an acceptable counter to the power it brings to the citizens, I think.

It also gives the mob another trick to play with: if one of them is uncovered they can claim to be the vigilante. The ploy doesn't work beyond a single day (unless they've silently killed the vigilante already), but as we've seen a single day in this game can be very powerful.

Miller + Vigilante adds depth, strategy and risk to both teams. That's why I like it.

eta: Actually, how about this. Instead of the morning report stating "x was killed by mafia; y was killed by the vigilante," it simply states "x and y were discovered dead." This would make any daytime mob vs. vigilante discussions very tense, since both parties could attempt to strike the other that night (angel actions notwithstanding).

Paul le Fou
02-22-2010, 04:21 PM
It also gives the mob another trick to play with: if one of them is uncovered they can claim to be the vigilante. The ploy doesn't work beyond a single day (unless they've silently killed the vigilante already), but as we've seen a single day in this game can be very powerful.

Miller + Vigilante adds depth, strategy and risk to both teams. That's why I like it.


Excellent point. Although the lack of ability to actually kill anyone at night means it won't last even if they've already killed the vigilante. But hey, it gets them one more day.

As for the unlabeled kills, I think we should put that off for one more game. Knowing who killed who can be pretty important, and while it adds another layer of mystery this is a game certainly not lacking in that, and pouring on too much threatens to stifle players. I mean, we were already shooting in the dark basically the entire time even with the info we had. Do we really just want to make it even that little bit darker?

Silent Noise
02-22-2010, 04:57 PM
Excellent point. Although the lack of ability to actually kill anyone at night means it won't last even if they've already killed the vigilante. But hey, it gets them one more day.

As for the unlabeled kills, I think we should put that off for one more game. Knowing who killed who can be pretty important, and while it adds another layer of mystery this is a game certainly not lacking in that, and pouring on too much threatens to stifle players. I mean, we were already shooting in the dark basically the entire time even with the info we had. Do we really just want to make it even that little bit darker?

The main reason for doing this is because if we combine miller and vigilante then even if they do show up guilty then they can very simply prove who they are, and in the end combining them just equals that they prove themselves when accused by someone who claims to be the investigator who is then also basically confirmed as a power role, it just makes the game easier to combine and tell who killed who.

Lucas
02-22-2010, 05:22 PM
The big thing with the Godfather idea is that the possibility of a false innocent report on investigation stirs up a whole lot more paranoia on the part of the citizens than a false guilty report. Imagine a game where you're down to six people and already have four of the mafia, but everyone left is checked out as innocent and, up to this point, has been trusted by everyone else.

Brickroad
02-22-2010, 05:28 PM
The big thing with the Godfather idea is that the possibility of a false innocent report on investigation stirs up a whole lot more paranoia on the part of the citizens than a false guilty report. Imagine a game where you're down to six people and already have four of the mafia, but everyone left is checked out as innocent and, up to this point, has been trusted by everyone else.

That doesn't sound like fun.

demonkoala
02-22-2010, 05:44 PM
That doesn't sound like fun.
Agreed.
Godfather effs the game too hard.

I will have to be on side with the Miller being a good role though. As a former do-no-gooder I know I wanted that Miller to show up and convolute things and save us one damn turn, even if it was one turn. It doesn't complicate the game all that much, but it sure does mess with people, and for that I like it. It's also one of the few ways of proving the Inspector's legitimacy, although a Vigilante + Miller combo also does this. I would almost venture to say both combo and Miller are good to have, but perhaps that helps the mafia too much.

Paul le Fou
02-22-2010, 05:50 PM
That doesn't sound like fun.

It sounds maddening.

I know the Miller helps the mafia, but wouldn't having one more mafia have the same effect for the citizens, and help the mafia even more, all while making the game a little more tense and fun without having to hide or obscure information.

SpoonyGundam
02-22-2010, 06:04 PM
I'm glad you guys caught on to the whole "too many powers make the game worse" thing this quickly.

Over at proto-Brontoforums, each new game got more and more complicated until most people just got sick of it. Sure, "Let's have werewolves and mafia and Godzilla!" or "Let's give everyone a power!" sounds neat at first, but it all just needlessly confuses the core game.

demonkoala
02-22-2010, 06:07 PM
I know the Miller helps the mafia, but wouldn't having one more mafia have the same effect for the citizens, and help the mafia even more, all while making the game a little more tense and fun without having to hide or obscure information.
Having another mafia member is more helpful, but there are some elements of gameplay added when there is a miller. You can use them as a sacrifice with less worries and what not. This would be even more helpful for mafia if they knew who was the miller (like they actually planted some false evidence to frame them). I think shit would get too ridiculous if the mafia got to choose who the miller is, but it would be an interesting alternative.
I'm glad you guys caught on to the whole "too many powers make the game worse" thing this quickly.

Yeah, I'm down for limited changes in general. Once we get used to this set some more, we can try swapping a few things out. Even without crazy powers this game was intense enough.

Sprite
02-22-2010, 06:21 PM
I do want to try the Medium role at least once, if only to see how it plays out. I could see them being a ton of fun. They would need to replace both the Oracle and Angel, though.

Though you guys are probably right that we shouldn't try it next game. I think just changing one or two things around each game will be best, to test balance (the current balance makes for a great game, I think). I also agree that we need a limited number of roles. If we try anything new it should replace something else.

Oh, and we're keeping the Oracle next game, right?

Kylie
02-22-2010, 06:42 PM
Given the role the Oracle played in THIS one, I can't imagine it would go.

Merus
02-22-2010, 06:51 PM
My feeling is that the game can be played perfectly fine with just mafia and citizens, and so adding new power roles should increase the amount of paranoia in the game without necessarily increasing the complexity. The best games are ones where the rules are simple but the game is nice and crunchy; Mafia does this well in the basic state, because its rules induce massive amounts of paranoia.

I don't feel like the Godfather increases the amount of paranoia except when the Inspector uses the strategy Brickroad did. If you specifically want to break that strategy, just drop the Inspector role; problem solved.

While I was initially curious to find out how not specifying how players died would work out, I imagine it wouldn't matter enough for it to be worth the uncertainty. If the vigilante and the mafia kill the same person, then there's only one death. If the vigilante's instructed to kill someone, there's two deaths and one's the named player. In nearly every case I can think of, the players could work out more or less which kills were the mafia and which were the vigilante; it doesn't really add as much as I'd hope.

I think part of it is that our Mafia in game one ceded control of the game to others while they worked on their cover; they had excellent cover, but they gave control of the game over to the Inspector, and it was all over from there. Also, Brickroad was the Inspector. I said on page one that Brickroad's side would probably win; I doubt people will let him get as far next time.

Silent Noise
02-22-2010, 07:57 PM
So are we going to pick someone or what? If you want an MVP it's Brickroad, If you want my vote it's Merus.

I really want to play already.

kaisel
02-22-2010, 07:58 PM
I think part of it is that our Mafia in game one ceded control of the game to others while they worked on their cover; they had excellent cover, but they gave control of the game over to the Inspector, and it was all over from there. Also, Brickroad was the Inspector. I said on page one that Brickroad's side would probably win; I doubt people will let him get as far next time.

As much as I hate to say it, pretty much this, though this was more because pretty much every mafia member hadn't actually played a game, and if I remember correctly only Ruik had actually even read a playthrough. I know if the five of us were all somehow picked as mafia members in the next game we'd have a... well, different showing at least, probably better.

I do think the miller role is a little "meh" as it is, I almost wish that the miller just always showed up as mafia, but that's more because our game didn't get much use out of the miller. It would be too powerful I suspect, especially if we added another player.

Also, as a somewhat random thought, I do hope that we get some people hoping for a mafia win next game, if for whatever reason, I end up not playing, I'm definitely going to cheer the mafia on.

As an extra sidenote, somewhere, way down the line when we've played a billion games, I think it'd be pretty neat (if unfeasible) to play a game where each player's screen name was just "Citizen_x", where x is a number. Granted, posting styles would still show who was each player, but it'd cut down on the metagaming a bit I suspect.

Paul le Fou
02-22-2010, 10:09 PM
As an extra sidenote, somewhere, way down the line when we've played a billion games, I think it'd be pretty neat (if unfeasible) to play a game where each player's screen name was just "Citizen_x", where x is a number. Granted, posting styles would still show who was each player, but it'd cut down on the metagaming a bit I suspect.

That would be really intense, but also a completely different game. Without people's personalities there... I don't know how well it would work out, but I'm intrigued. Also it would end up hard to keep track of who's who. I accuse citizen 13! Shit that was a typo I meant 3 oh no we lynched the inspector! Well, probably not that harsh, but you know.


Also, whoever runs the next game will (should) have a signup period for everyone who's interested to drift back, check in, and sign up, so it'll likely be a few days before the next game gets off the ground either way.

...on a semi-related note, does anyone know if you can have multiple polls in a single thread?

Destil
02-22-2010, 10:26 PM
While I was initially curious to find out how not specifying how players died would work out, I imagine it wouldn't matter enough for it to be worth the uncertainty. If the vigilante and the mafia kill the same person, then there's only one death. If the vigilante's instructed to kill someone, there's two deaths and one's the named player. In nearly every case I can think of, the players could work out more or less which kills were the mafia and which were the vigilante; it doesn't really add as much as I'd hope.

The one thing I think this allows is a fake mafia vigilante as possibility. As it stands now that's by far the hardest role for the mafia to try and buff. It would be extrremlly suspicious, of course, if someone comes forward as that role and then only one person dies that night if the citizens call for action, but as it stands now the only possibility to fake that is hope they call for no one to die (and you better believe the real vigilantie will hit the fraud as soon as possible if s/he's alive).

The lack of tension on turn one could possibly be solved by a forced lynch. While I like the idea of letting the mafia get a free night kill before the game starts to shake things up it would suck to be that player and with nothing for them to go on it would be rather random. It's also unneeded as far as flavor text goes: on the first night (before the game begins), the mafia kills the narrator, who learned too much and leaves a note warning the rest of the town. I think a must lynch day 1 rule (with the option to abstain later) would be good for keeping tension high.

I like the current voting system, but in the name of speeding things up I don't mind the vote for anyone idea. How are ties determined? First person to switch their vote?

Eddie
02-22-2010, 10:32 PM
I like the idea of a forced lynch on day 1. In fact, I like the idea of a forced lynch on every day.

Edit: As for the idea of "citizen 1 (through x)", you could do that, but make it less confusing by making the names something like "(M)Butcher", "(M)Baker", "(M)CandlestickMaker" etc. The idea of having town 'roles' was an idea that was too quickly abandoned.

- Eddie

Destil
02-22-2010, 10:33 PM
I do think the miller role is a little "meh" as it is, I almost wish that the miller just always showed up as mafia, but that's more because our game didn't get much use out of the miller. It would be too powerful I suspect, especially if we added another player.

My problem with such a rule is that it adds nothing to the game, really. The citizens, in effect, just have to kill an extra 'mafia' who doesn't get any input on night killings. Unless by luck of the draw the miller is left alive after all the mafia it's just a higher body count the citizens will need, so at that point why not just add a member to the mob and let them have some fun?

Paul le Fou
02-22-2010, 10:34 PM
on the first night (before the game begins), the mafia kills the narrator, who learned too much and leaves a note warning the rest of the town.

That is actually exactly how I planned on starting the game if I get to narrate. Well not exactly exactly, but yeah, same basic idea.

Brickroad
02-22-2010, 10:35 PM
Hey Paul, if you narrate plz rig the random draw so Merus and I really are both Mafia this time.

Merus, same request, except with me and Paul.

kthx

Merus
02-22-2010, 10:43 PM
I like the current voting system, but in the name of speeding things up I don't mind the vote for anyone idea. How are ties determined? First person to switch their vote?

No ties. You still require a majority to lynch.

Lucas
02-22-2010, 10:45 PM
The idea of having town 'roles' was an idea that was too quickly abandoned.

- Eddie

That's because Mafia is srs bzns.

spineshark
02-22-2010, 11:32 PM
Hey Paul, if you narrate plz rig the random draw so Merus and I really are both Mafia this time.

Merus, same request, except with me and Paul.

kthx
If I'm host, I can make all three of you Mafia. In fact, that way, you guys might not even need anyone else!

Brickroad
02-22-2010, 11:37 PM
If I'm host, I can make all three of you Mafia. In fact, that way, you guys might not even need anyone else!

Well go ahead and give us Silent Noise and Alice just to round things out.

Matchstick
02-22-2010, 11:43 PM
...on a semi-related note, does anyone know if you can have multiple polls in a single thread?

No, you can't.

Merus
02-23-2010, 12:33 AM
If I'm host, I'm going to tell you that I made you all citizens, but maybe not actually do it.

(But if Brick is a special role again I'm totally going to reroll)

(It's going to be so obvious that I'm mafia)

Dizzy
02-23-2010, 02:22 AM
That's a brilliant idea, Merus. Someone must now do that! I demand it!

Phantoon
02-23-2010, 02:27 AM
If I'm host, I'm going to tell you that I made you all citizens, but maybe not actually do it.

(But if Brick is a special role again I'm totally going to reroll)

(It's going to be so obvious that I'm mafia)

If Brick gets the Miller role leave it as it is. Ho ho ho.

SpecBebop
02-23-2010, 08:47 AM
I just want to say that I just read through the entire first game thread in one sitting, and was completely riveted.

I'd love to play if I knew I had the time, but even reading along is very exciting.

Sprite
02-23-2010, 08:54 AM
First night: Brickroad was killed by the Mafia and the Vigilante, but saved by two angels.

Silent Noise
02-23-2010, 09:00 AM
Well go ahead and give us Silent Noise and Alice just to round things out.

I didn't get to play! You have no inkling of how good a player I am.

Comb Stranger
02-23-2010, 09:17 AM
I can't wait until Silent Noise gets shotgunned on the first night again. There will be rofling.

Destil
02-23-2010, 10:12 AM
I can't wait until Silent Noise gets shotgunned on the first night again. There will be rofling.

Though it would be pretty cruel, I can totally see it happening for several games in a row...

Silent Noise
02-23-2010, 11:15 AM
I can't wait until Silent Noise gets shotgunned on the first night again. There will be rofling.

Though it would be pretty cruel, I can totally see it happening for several games in a row...

Oh come on! >:l Can you guys really say that you know me well enough to see how I would behave in the game? Come on guys, I have quite a few of these games under my belt, and killing off people that you just don't like is the dumbest thing.

If this keeps up I won't play, you only saw what I did on day one things don't get real untill day two.

Geeze, don't judge a player outside of the game.

Merus
02-23-2010, 12:44 PM
Oh come on! >:l Can you guys really say that you know me well enough to see how I would behave in the game?

I'm pretty sure I could, though it'd be a bit rude.

Of course, if you surprised us all and played an under-the-radar game then things might be different.

Brickroad
02-23-2010, 01:35 PM
More Silent Noise bellyaching. Give it a rest, dude.

spineshark
02-23-2010, 04:08 PM
We haven't even decided who's running it yet.

Destil
02-23-2010, 05:17 PM
Also, whoever runs the next game will (should) have a signup period for everyone who's interested to drift back, check in, and sign up, so it'll likely be a few days before the next game gets off the ground either way.

...on a semi-related note, does anyone know if you can have multiple polls in a single thread?

Then someone should make a sign-up specific thread with a vote for the narrator. It'll keep this thread cleaner and signal to anyone wanting in that a new game is starting.

Brickroad
02-23-2010, 05:25 PM
Then someone should make a sign-up specific thread with a vote for the narrator. It'll keep this thread cleaner and signal to anyone wanting in that a new game is starting.

I WILL DO IT

I WILL DO IT NINE TIMES

(okay just one time)

Merus
02-23-2010, 05:56 PM
Hee, hee, "PapilanRell".

gamin
02-23-2010, 06:37 PM
This is looking to be a massive second game.

spineshark
02-23-2010, 06:57 PM
(Brick also suggested Google Docs or something as an alternate snoop-proof means of mafioso communication, but in the event the mafia elects to go with TT's built-in PM system, this is my suggestion.)
This would actually be really good if we end up with enough players to up the mafia by two or more people.

Merus
02-23-2010, 06:58 PM
This is looking to be a massive second game.
Yeah... that's a massive vote for me as GM, too. Lot of pressure!

The tricky bit is deciding how I'm going to break up the roles - if there's significantly more players than last time, I might have to double up on a couple of roles. I might need to harass Matchstick to bump up the amount of people we can PM at once.

kaisel
02-23-2010, 07:18 PM
Yeah... that's a massive vote for me as GM, too. Lot of pressure!

The tricky bit is deciding how I'm going to break up the roles - if there's significantly more players than last time, I might have to double up on a couple of roles. I might need to harass Matchstick to bump up the amount of people we can PM at once.

Or we could do the google docs thing (or google wave I guess, I have a ton of invites still, 7 I think), makes it easier to post all the communications as well.

Merus
02-23-2010, 07:53 PM
I can invite pretty much all the mafia to Google Wave if they don't have it (I have like 50-something invites); I was thinking specifically about informing them of the results of the kill, but then I guess it's not really a problem if I'm part of the mafia discussions, is it?

NevznachaY
02-24-2010, 12:14 AM
Two things:
1) I'm absolutely burned out on real-life mafia (school, university, hrmmmmm), and I never would have guessed that I would be this enthralled with watching people play. This stuff is way more intense than the stuff I'm used to.
2) We should have flexible bets for non-playing people. The prize could be some, erm, drawing? By one of our resident masters?

Dizzy
02-28-2010, 01:40 PM
Here's my MGS template for Mafia:

"2005AT (Alternative Timeline). Shadow Moses Parks and Recreations. Special Forces Unit FOXHOUND infiltrates the ranks of OUTER HEAVEN* to stop the development of a new METAL GEAR. They must destroy OUTER HEAVEN while keeping their identities secret.

Players:

FOXHOUND:
- Solid Snake (no significant powers)
- X amount of players

OUTER HEAVEN:
- Revolver Ocelot (Inspector)
- Psycho Mantis (Oracle)
- Cyborg Ninja (Vigilante)
- Decoy Octopus (Miller)
- Sniper Wolf (Angel 1)
- Vulcan Raven (Angel 2)
- X amount of players (Genome soldiers)


*Yes, I know FOXHOUND was the bad guys but they eventually decided to morph into Big Boss's wet dream.

Garrison
02-28-2010, 01:45 PM
So Foxhound would be the equivalent to the Mafia and the Genome Soldiers would be the citizens. That sounds like an interesting idea, it'll keep the Mafia theme from getting too stale.

Dizzy
02-28-2010, 01:49 PM
Oh yeah, duh! Genome soldiers!

demonkoala
03-01-2010, 09:43 AM
DAMMMMMMNNNNNITTTTT

Why am I not playing, this is fantastic, but no.
Also, I don't think a lot of people have realized that the rules have changed. If I'm reading correctly, there isn't a vote on lynchings, but its done by a majority of accusations.

Two threads is confusing, but I'm doing ok. Strategy is pretty different.

Sprite
03-01-2010, 09:45 AM
I'm not sure about how I feel about no defense posts. Someone could end up dead in a matter of minutes and have no chance to defend themselves. Next game, I suppose.

Brickroad
03-01-2010, 09:55 AM
Mafia East is already on page two!

Woo! We're winning!

dwolfe
03-01-2010, 10:25 AM
brick, when a full page of posts are yours, you can't cheer on team east (note: will not look at mafia east till after mafia west kicks your sorry a$$, so that is totally made up).

we're just the EFFICIENT cardinal direction!

Merus
03-01-2010, 12:00 PM
I'm not sure about how I feel about no defense posts. Someone could end up dead in a matter of minutes and have no chance to defend themselves.

In practice, I won't let this happen (lynchings only happen when I say they do), but it'd be nice to formalise it somehow.

Sprite
03-01-2010, 12:29 PM
In practice, I won't let this happen

Good to know, boss. I retract my trepidation.

Man, the West game just exploded. I'll be looking forward to spectating it once my game is done.

Alpha Werewolf
03-01-2010, 12:38 PM
Man, the West game just exploded. I'll be looking forward to spectating it once my game is done.

I'll take the credit for that. I look forward to reading it tommorow, because I'm going to sleep right now.

shivam
03-01-2010, 12:47 PM
i kinda feel that these two offspring games are missing the charm of the first one, where no one knew what was going on, and there was a lot more caution and paranoia. By contrast, today is Day 1 and it already feels like we're knee deep in the dead.

Phantoon
03-01-2010, 12:50 PM
I think that's actually more to do with the fact we can't go to day 2 without lynching. There are loads of unknowns to me in the West game that I can't read yet which is making me far more paranoid than I was at this stage in game 1.

Silent Noise
03-01-2010, 12:58 PM
Huh, looking at Marion's posts in the other thread it doesn't seem like him, let me try something he told me about when I last spoke with him... yep this Marion is the copycat that he told me is going around.

shivam
03-01-2010, 01:01 PM
what the hell does that even mean.

SpoonyGundam
03-01-2010, 01:14 PM
He's saying that the Marion in the west game must be an impostor because he's playing badly compared to how he knows him to play in real life.

shivam
03-01-2010, 01:15 PM
how silly.

Silent Noise
03-01-2010, 01:24 PM
Actually the one I know is a mod, he used a different name for modding and then when the imposter showed up he got locked and he had some other cases of this elsewhere, each time the guy used the same password, I know the password and I was able to log onto his account using it, this guy is a troll in games, he tries to kill himself.

VorpalEdge
03-01-2010, 01:26 PM
It's weird, because not only does his writing style sound like he's straight-up saying everything he thinks out loud (quick, rapid replies to everything, comma overuse, etc), but his posts would be a lot more effective in real life too. It's a lot less deliberate and a lot more bloodthirsty. Over-defensiveness there is par for the course.

[edit because i got sniped] ... huh.

Silent Noise
03-01-2010, 01:36 PM
It gets worse, I let a guy who I thought was Marion set up an account using my email, I just spoke with the real one and he said he never asked this... I should have known, he said he wasn't using that name on new sites anymore, I should have realised this sooner... I'm sorry guys.

(At least I never used that email)

dwolfe
03-01-2010, 01:38 PM
Actually the one I know is a mod, he used a different name for modding and then when the imposter showed up he got locked and he had some other cases of this elsewhere, each time the guy used the same password, I know the password and I was able to log onto his account using it, this guy is a troll in games, he tries to kill himself.

English? are you saying we have a random 'troll' who happens to want to play forum games with us? Or that your buddy Marion got his password stolen because he uses the same one everywhere?

PLEASE DO NOT READ THE OTHER GAME THREAD GUYS

I'm really looking forward to seeing how the other game turns out, and using the other thread for ideas is metagaming douchbaggery.

dtsund
03-01-2010, 01:38 PM
It gets worse, I let a guy who I thought was Marion set up an account using my email, I just spoke with the real one and he said he never asked this... I should have known, he said he wasn't using that name on new sites anymore, I should have realised this sooner... I'm sorry guys.

(At least I never used that email)

Well, he might well be lynched soon anyway.

PapillonReel
03-01-2010, 01:41 PM
PLEASE DO NOT READ THE OTHER GAME THREAD GUYS

Pfft, like I could keep up with both even if I tried. :rolleyes:

But yeah, srsly. Keep it to one thread, guys.

Silent Noise
03-01-2010, 01:46 PM
Dwolfe you have a troll who uses the name my friend uses, the troll uses the same password everywhere and he plays normally then he trys to get himself killed.

I would attempt to find a replacement for that spot, the troll usally lists off all the mafios if he is one as soon as he dies.

If you want I could prove that it is the troll, I could change his title to doofuspants.

Kylie
03-01-2010, 01:53 PM
Or you could just change your password and finish his role in both games.

Dizzy
03-01-2010, 01:58 PM
I think someone needs to sit in the corner for a while and do some serious thinking.

dtsund
03-01-2010, 02:03 PM
If you want I could prove that it is the troll, I could change his title to doofuspants.

If you're going to do it, do it now before he reads this and changes his password. If he is who you think he is, at least.

Marion
03-01-2010, 02:08 PM
To really prove it I'm posting! It's me Silent Noise.

I'll stay on as him for a bit untill we can take care of this.

shivam
03-01-2010, 02:10 PM
lol. I can do this too! Look guys, I'm Silent Noise! I'm jumping from account to account to invite my 'friends' to 'play' so that I look "cool".

Just kidding. I'm actually Tomm.

Marion
03-01-2010, 02:12 PM
lol. I can do this too! Look guys, I'm Silent Noise! I'm jumping from account to account to invite my 'friends' to 'play' so that I look "cool".

Just kidding. I'm actually Tomm.

Oh come on, I wouldn't do that, besides I would be cheating if I hadn't known that we would split into two.

Edit: Ban this bastard. Besides as long as he gets lynched I doubt you'll have to restart.

dtsund
03-01-2010, 02:18 PM
For God's sake. I don't know whether to call for "Marion's" banning so he can be replaced or what. This is so stupid and if we have to start our game over as a result, I'm going to be pissed.

This.

Edit: Ban this bastard.

You mean ban Marion, or shivam? 'Cause I initially read that as the latter, and I was about to type up something utterly incredulous.

spineshark
03-01-2010, 02:21 PM
For God's sake. I don't know whether to call for "Marion's" banning so he can be replaced or what. This is so stupid and if we have to start our game over as a result, I'm going to be pissed.
Match will be able to check IPs now and see what the deal is.

shivam
03-01-2010, 02:22 PM
man, if i get banned three posts from 10,000, i'll be very sad.

Silent Noise
03-01-2010, 02:26 PM
I didn't mean Shivam! Although what you said was rather cold...

Tock
03-01-2010, 02:29 PM
Wait, so a player is getting wiped from the forum on gameday one? Ugh, I hope this doesn't screw up your game. Sorry, Westies.

Metagame mafia shenanigans, pfeh.

SilentSnake
03-01-2010, 02:31 PM
Marion is going to be out temporarily until we figure out what's really going on here. Stay tuned.

demonkoala
03-01-2010, 02:33 PM
man, if i get banned three posts from 10,000, i'll be very sad.
Man. How about 1 post before? (At least the number would be epic)


Edit: Ban this bastard. Besides as long as he gets lynched I doubt you'll have to restart.
I hope SilentNoise remains silent and was smart enough to not check PMs. I don't like my entertainment ruined.

P.S. Enjoyin both games, guys.

dtsund
03-01-2010, 02:34 PM
Marion is going to be out temporarily until we figure out what's really going on here. Stay tuned.

You are a good person.

Man. How about 1 post before? (At least the number would be epic)

It's over NINE THO-*shot*

dwolfe
03-01-2010, 02:37 PM
It's over NINE THO-*shot*

You're not even at NINE HUND-*shot*

Phantoon
03-01-2010, 02:43 PM
West Side is winning on pure drama alone

I'm guessing, I'm not reading the East Side thread until we're done.

dwolfe
03-01-2010, 02:45 PM
This whole marion thing? It's like Silent Noise is getting revenge for that hissy fit last game, I swear. In a karmic sense.

No offense, man, but you were the one who invited him, and only now suggested he's a troll. It's just too good.

I really, really hope he doesn't break our game. :(

Mafia East, carry on, you shining stars!

Mr. J
03-01-2010, 02:50 PM
Can we get matchstick to check this out plz. Him or parish can clear this up easily. No need throwing a hissy fit over anything.

Ruik
03-01-2010, 02:52 PM
Aauurgh, I didn't join so that I wouldn't waste time on mafia when I should be doing other things. And now I just wasted 1.5 hours reading the threads when I should be working on a paper. Stop being so entertaining people!

SuperRube
03-01-2010, 02:57 PM
Man, is it just me or is Noise just weirding everything up right now? I mean, I was ready to chalk up his stuff in the East thread due to poor planning but now with the whole Marion thing being discussed here and all this metagame garbage I just don't know what to think.

Actually, I don't know if this is an official rule or not, but and I hate to make things more complicated then they need to be... but anyone else thing we should officially say that people in game A shouldn't be reading thread B and vice versa? I'll admit to skimming the West thread just due to curiosity and the like but now it seems like it could have a negative effect on this whole thing. Which sucks because I really was enjoying how things have been going.

SpecBebop
03-01-2010, 03:00 PM
Aauurgh, I didn't join so that I wouldn't waste time on mafia when I should be doing other things. And now I just wasted 1.5 hours reading the threads when I should be working on a paper. Stop being so entertaining people!

It's more time consuming to not play, since you can follow both threads.

kaisel
03-01-2010, 03:01 PM
Man, is it just me or is Noise just weirding everything up right now? I mean, I was ready to chalk up his stuff in the East thread due to poor planning but now with the whole Marion thing being discussed here and all this metagame garbage I just don't know what to think.

Actually, I don't know if this is an official rule or not, but and I hate to make things more complicated then they need to be... but anyone else thing we should officially say that people in game A shouldn't be reading thread B and vice versa? I'll admit to skimming the West thread just due to curiosity and the like but now it seems like it could have a negative effect on this whole thing. Which sucks because I really was enjoying how things have been going.

There was talk about it when it was decided the games would be split. For now, I'd say everyone should act on it as a very strong guideline to only read the thread that you're gaming in. I mean, we should be able to police ourselves, and I don't think anyone should be too bent out of shape if someone from East reads West or vice versa, it's just a game, y'know?

I do think that people from one game should refrain from posting about the other game, unless it's about like number of posts or something.

dwolfe
03-01-2010, 03:06 PM
PLEASE DO NOT READ THE OTHER GAME THREAD IF YOU ARE PLAYING

I'm really looking forward to seeing how the other game turns out, and using the other thread for ideas, or being Silent Noise/Marion today, is metagaming douchbaggery.

Tock
03-01-2010, 03:23 PM
The way West-side drama has been spilling into the overall thread, you almost don't have to read their game! Their wacky adventures can be heard over the Sicilian wall.

Anyhow, I'm with dwolfe, for the reason that time spent lurking on the other thread is better time spent making your own thread exciting, or at the very least spent lurking and waiting to strike. Also, metagaming is the worst.

Sprite
03-01-2010, 04:24 PM
/facepalm

DemoWeasel
03-01-2010, 04:30 PM
What the hell is going on here?

EDIT: Oh, I see. Still, what the fuck?

Dizzy
03-01-2010, 04:36 PM
It's like watching one of those mentally soft big kids try to do cart wheels in a china shop.

VorpalEdge
03-01-2010, 04:39 PM
Can we get matchstick to check this out plz. Him or parish can clear this up easily. No need throwing a hissy fit over anything.

I PMed him a couple hours ago. At this point, I guess we just wait and see.

Guesty
03-01-2010, 04:48 PM
SN, I thought you were actually OK if a bit hasty to post until you made that alt account. Why, man? Just, why?
________
Rohypnol rehab dicussion (http://www.rehab-forum.com/rohypnol-rehab/)

Sprite
03-01-2010, 04:50 PM
Let's wait for a moderator to weigh in before we rage.

SilentSnake
03-01-2010, 04:55 PM
Yeah, like I said, we're looking into the facts at the moment. Merus will be notified of anything that effects the games and adjust accordingly.

In the mean time: Nothing to see here. Move along.

Guesty
03-01-2010, 04:56 PM
Ah, ok. If it does turn out to be what I suspect though, then the vigilante should kill him if only Marion is banned.
________
MEDICAL MARIJUANA CARD (http://medicalmarijuanacard.info)

Merus
03-01-2010, 05:38 PM
God what are you people doing to my beautiful game.

I'm happy to take suggestions on what to do if a player betrays their teammates, but for now the game continues as normal. I'd prefer players to deal with problems via lynching - I don't think that the Inspector is going to be as crucial in either game as it was in Game 1.

I may add to the official rules that a player has about 24 hours to defend themselves after an accusation is made before they can be lynched. I was planning on doing this anyway, but I feel like it'd be better to make it clear.

Dizzy
03-01-2010, 05:41 PM
I'm surprised you are GMing two games of this magnitude. That's practically a full time job. While I'm not putting myself out there I'd consider getting another GM.

Merus
03-01-2010, 05:44 PM
24 hours from the first person's accusation, but that's why I'm inviting input.

kaisel
03-01-2010, 05:47 PM
I think that's pretty fair, though it might help if the first accusation is made in some sort of bright color (red or something) each time, I think it might be easier to miss this game, since the game's moving faster, and I suspect on paranoid days accusations are going to fly around like crazy.

shivam
03-01-2010, 05:47 PM
if marion is bumped, i'll take his place if yall want.

Garrison
03-01-2010, 05:49 PM
Happy 10,000th post Shivam

Anyways, I second the movement of redding accusations.

SuperRube
03-01-2010, 05:51 PM
Man, this game would be perfect if we didn't have to have people actually play it.

Meditative_Zebra
03-01-2010, 05:52 PM
10,000th post

I think you deserve a prize when you reach that many posts. Party at Parish's!

Destil
03-01-2010, 06:19 PM
Actually, I don't know if this is an official rule or not, but and I hate to make things more complicated then they need to be... but anyone else thing we should officially say that people in game A shouldn't be reading thread B and vice versa? I'll admit to skimming the West thread just due to curiosity and the like but now it seems like it could have a negative effect on this whole thing. Which sucks because I really was enjoying how things have been going.

I read a bit of the first page of the west game. It's really, different. I think after day one the games will have diverged to the point where leaching ideas isn't as big a deal, but for now I'm good with that.

Merus
03-01-2010, 06:31 PM
I don't know if Marion is actually banned yet; Matchstick did apparently mention that he'd let me know.

Paul le Fou
03-01-2010, 07:44 PM
you didn't see the SN = Marion thing coming from a mile away? Really?

Brickroad
03-01-2010, 08:25 PM
Yeah really. Talk about "obvious troll is obvious".

Tock
03-01-2010, 08:29 PM
Speaking personally, I'd want, or wanted, to give SN the benefit of the doubt (edit: and wait for Matchstick to get back to Merus about what's what). I have to admit it's making me look a little internet-forum-naive right now.

I don't want to boot him/them without knowing what's really going on, but at the same time I don't want this mess to hold up the games. Ugh.

Merus
03-01-2010, 09:20 PM
I admit I was trying to give SN the benefit of the doubt as well, so I feel a little foolish. On the other hand, I'm glad that we'll apparently be able to deal with it inside the rules.

Destil
03-01-2010, 09:47 PM
You wanted to? I argued not to lynch him first hoping the damn kid would get it and actually join us for a fun game this time. Ah, well. Here's hoping.

Paul le Fou
03-02-2010, 12:12 AM
If Marion is SN and stays banned, what happens to actual SN? Will this mess up the east game too? I mean, more than SN already has :P

Merus
03-02-2010, 12:29 AM
My take on all this is that West isn't particularly messed up - "Marion" made a lot of enemies very quickly, even before he was banned, and gave the citizens a way out of day 1. I see no reason to interfere, and I'm actually a little delighted that metagaming got someone killed.

If Silent Noise is banned, I'll sub in a replacement. As with West, I see no reason to interfere at the moment.

Phantoon
03-02-2010, 01:33 AM
As Merus says, it may affect the East game more than ours - Marion is brown bread as it stands. I'll be annoyed if he was the Inspector but we'll just have to cope with whatever happens.

DemoWeasel
03-02-2010, 07:08 AM
Hahaha awesome.

Alpha Werewolf
03-02-2010, 07:13 AM
Hahaha awesome.

WITH CHIPS

Phantoon
03-02-2010, 07:23 AM
Oh hells yeah.

dwolfe
03-02-2010, 09:13 AM
So, did anyone figure out this SN/Marion thing? Has SN been active since he got called out over in East?

West knows how to solve problems...permanently. Step it up, Easties!

John
03-02-2010, 09:36 AM
SN has also been banned. I'm guessing Merus's looking for a replacement, since Day 1 is still ongoing over there.

dtsund
03-02-2010, 10:13 AM
So, did anyone figure out this SN/Marion thing? Has SN been active since he got called out over in East?

West knows how to solve problems...permanently. Step it up, Easties!

Indeed we do. Hey easties, we've killed a Mafia. What do you have to show?

Was anything ever found on whether they were the same person?

Brickroad
03-02-2010, 10:15 AM
West knows how to solve problems...permanently. Step it up, Easties!

Hey, we know better than to murder our stupid with reckless impunity. We know how to put our stupid to work for us.

dwolfe
03-02-2010, 10:43 AM
Hey, we know better than to murder our stupid with reckless impunity. We know how to put our stupid to work for us.

But...but...I'm a Westie! I'm not working for you no mo'!

Alpha Werewolf
03-02-2010, 10:59 AM
Hey, we know better than to murder our stupid with reckless impunity. We know how to put our stupid to work for us.

I invite you to put a banned member to work, brick. That'd be quite an accomplishement.

Loki
03-02-2010, 11:03 AM
All I know is that I once saw a bunch of Easties eating out of a garbage can. I shined my flashlight on them and they ran off into the night.

Sprite
03-02-2010, 11:06 AM
That was no Easty, that was your wife!

Loki
03-02-2010, 11:07 AM
Crude. Just like an Eastie.

dtsund
03-02-2010, 11:25 AM
Man, if the citizens of one side win and the others don't, there is going to be so much trash talk here.

Alpha Werewolf
03-02-2010, 11:31 AM
You kidding? Even if we both LOSE we're gonna trash talk.

dtsund
03-02-2010, 11:32 AM
You kidding? Even if we both LOSE we're gonna trash talk.

I know; I'm just saying, though, that if the citizens win exactly one game, it's going to go through the roof.

Sprite
03-02-2010, 11:51 AM
Just wait until Metal Gear Mafia when we can use themed trash talk. I for one hope I end up in the Shadow Moses game.

Alpha Werewolf
03-02-2010, 11:52 AM
I have GOT to run a specialty later on, not this french vannila stuff we have here so far.

Phantoon
03-02-2010, 12:06 PM
Hey, we know better than to murder our stupid with reckless impunity. We know how to put our stupid to work for us.

What're they doing? Your timekeeping? HO HO HO

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/tt161/Phantoon/sonicth2idleb.gif

Alpha Werewolf
03-02-2010, 12:17 PM
:confused:

Phantoon
03-02-2010, 12:22 PM
I'm waiting for those Easties to killl some Mafia.

Still waiting.

Tock
03-02-2010, 12:36 PM
Man, you Westos are going to be so embarrassed when a fifteen-year-old troll hands you a free mafia kill on Day One and you still lose.

Phantoon
03-02-2010, 12:43 PM
This thread is in serious danger of being even more entertaining than the proper threads.

McDohl
03-02-2010, 12:54 PM
The East: -wordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswords wordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswords-

The West: "Fuck that guy, he's a fucking mafia shithead!" "Cool, we were right!"

Actions speak louder than words.

Comb Stranger
03-02-2010, 01:01 PM
I would totally play the Shadow Moses game.

Garrison
03-02-2010, 01:03 PM
This may be a tad early for this(probably by a month), but I want in on Shadow Moses.

Dizzy
03-02-2010, 01:08 PM
Dagnabit! Putting down my reservation for OPERATION: SHADOW MOSES.

I know I retired from FOXHOUND, but I'm ready for one last job.

Sprite
03-02-2010, 01:09 PM
This thread is in serious danger of being even more entertaining than the proper threads.

Agreed. Having separate games was a really good idea.

Rai
03-02-2010, 01:58 PM
Special Role: Johnny
- Doesn't show up as anything to the Inspector equivalent
- Can come with an eleventh hour save

Seriously though, East, speed it up. I haven't looked in to see where you are, I just know you haven't finished up the day. So slow.

Sprite
03-02-2010, 02:02 PM
You're not the boss of us!

Rai
03-02-2010, 02:06 PM
I could have been, but then the railroad decided to screw up everyone's tickets.

Really quite the tragedy.

dtsund
03-02-2010, 02:24 PM
You're not the boss of us!

Then who is this 'boss' of yours? The Don? Eh?

Merus
03-02-2010, 03:14 PM
SN has also been banned. I'm guessing Merus's looking for a replacement, since Day 1 is still ongoing over there.

I haven't heard anything about Silent Noise being banned. I sent a message to SilentSnake to find out what's going on for sure, and I'll make my decision based on what he says.

Of course, I'm not sure anyone is crazy enough to step into a position with a gigantic target on their backs.

SuperRube
03-02-2010, 03:46 PM
Dudes coming up pretty damn banned to me. (http://www.gamespite.net/talkingtime/member.php?u=15987)

Which is good because I was about to step on his neck myself. I don't even have any special powers or nothing. I would find a way to make it happen.

Also you westies shouldn't be so cocky seeing as you've actually killed a super secret double reverse mafia.

Loki
03-02-2010, 03:54 PM
Also you westies shouldn't be so cocky seeing as...

That's "westo" to you, Eastie.

SuperRube
03-02-2010, 04:07 PM
That's "westo" to you, Eastie.

Don't you try to control me, westafarian.

Brickroad
03-02-2010, 05:03 PM
Westies walk like this:
hrm hrm hrm, hrm hrm, hrm hrm hrm.

Easties walk like this:
doo doot doo, doot doot doo doo.

dtsund
03-02-2010, 05:20 PM
Westies talk like this:
You see that man? He is Mafia, and will not live to see another day.

Easties talk like this:
You see that man? He is Mafia. Let us consider killing him. Maybe. If it won't hurt anyone's feelings, and after thinking it over for a few days.

Nerdy
03-02-2010, 05:26 PM
That's "westo" to you, Eastie.
Whatever, Westley.

Merus
03-02-2010, 05:34 PM
Tell me, dtsund, what makes a good man go Eastie? Lust for endless debate? Power he won't use? Or were they just born with a heart full of easterness?

A random seed!

I have been informed that Silent Noise has been banned temporarily. As I've said before, I feel like his sockpuppetting has little to do with him being a bad player.

I'm leaning away from subbing because of the unique position Silent Noise placed himself in, and because his ban should end before day 1 does. He'll be able to participate soon enough. Until that time, any accusations against Silent Noise do not require a defence from him. That is, any lynch will be instant.

If Silent Noise does not return by the end of night 1, I'll sub in a replacement, if anyone is game, and night will be extended if necessary.

Loki
03-02-2010, 05:51 PM
Whatever, Westley.

As

you

wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiisssssssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhh ..........

VorpalEdge
03-02-2010, 06:07 PM
We're endearingly competent! Easties just push people off cliffs.

Umby
03-02-2010, 06:56 PM
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGH

Traumadore
03-02-2010, 06:58 PM
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGH

Did anyone see him hit the bottom? I didn't have a good angle.

Umby
03-02-2010, 07:01 PM
Did anyone see him hit the bottom? I didn't have a good angle.

You never know, I could be saved.

PLEASE SAVE ME

Alpha Werewolf
03-02-2010, 09:20 PM
Worst Day One ever.
Actual quote from the Eastie thread.

SpecBebop
03-02-2010, 09:28 PM
Actual quote from the Eastie thread.

No peeking!

Also, I'm jealous of the Easties' game, since they're almost a hundred posts ahead of us. We could be arguing all through the night too!

Brickroad
03-02-2010, 09:30 PM
Is "no peeking" an actual for-real rule? Or is it just something you Westies agreed on?

I haven't looked at the Westie thread although god damn the temptation has been almost irresistable.

kaisel
03-02-2010, 09:49 PM
Actual quote from the Eastie thread.

We agreed on it in West to prevent metagame ridiculousness from polluting our game. You're going to laugh when you find out just what it was that tipped us to Marion.

Apparently only some of you agreed :).

Comb Stranger
03-02-2010, 10:30 PM
So Silent Noise doesn't have a friend after all.

The world makes sense again.

Paul le Fou
03-02-2010, 10:38 PM
So Silent Noise doesn't have a friend after all.

The world makes sense again.

Out of so many suspicious clues, this was perhaps the most suspicious of them all.

Phantoon
03-02-2010, 10:57 PM
I'm not looking at the Eastie thread until we're finished. Being a westie is time consuming enough.

chady
03-03-2010, 12:22 AM
Augh, the suspense in these mafia threads is killing me. It's almost enough to make me de-lurk permanently...

almost.

Brickroad
03-03-2010, 12:24 AM
Augh, the suspense in these mafia threads is killing me. It's almost enough to make me de-lurk permanently...

almost.

I dunno dude, four posts in 3.5 years? You're practically a regular.

shivam
03-03-2010, 12:26 AM
man, brick, i love you and everything, but you turn into a complete douchebag in the mafia threads.

Brickroad
03-03-2010, 12:29 AM
man, brick, i love you and everything, but you turn into a complete douchebag in the mafia threads.

That just means I'm not trying hard enough in the rest of the threads I post in. =)

shivam
03-03-2010, 12:32 AM
lol. one of these days, you're gonna have to come out west so we can hang out.

chady
03-03-2010, 02:01 AM
I dunno dude, four posts in 3.5 years? You're practically a regular.

What? It's been 2 1/2 years. At least do the math.

And that makes FIVE. Wow, I'm on a roll.

Brickroad
03-03-2010, 02:18 AM
What? It's been 2 1/2 years. At least do the math.

Pfft, maths.

Loki
03-03-2010, 04:44 AM
This just in! Easties hate simple arithmetic; think sun goes around earth.

Sprite
03-03-2010, 04:56 AM
I will destroy our Mafia with the power of cold hard numbers, Westacian, and then I shall come for you.

Cower at my high-school level math education

Phantoon
03-03-2010, 05:08 AM
I will destroy our Mafia with the power of cold hard numbers, Westacian, and then I shall come for you.



Hope you don't run as fast as you play - you'll never catch a Westo.

Brickroad
03-03-2010, 05:27 AM
We hate deaf people too.

We hate deaf people so much.

Sprite
03-03-2010, 06:35 AM
I didn't vote for Umby because I've had a year of American Sign Language.

I could've translated, guys!

dwolfe
03-03-2010, 07:28 AM
man, brick, i love you and everything, but you turn into a complete douchebag in the mafia threads.

Urge...to read Mafia East game...rising.

Comb Stranger
03-03-2010, 08:13 AM
Man, the East game! Could you believe it when that bear jumped a shark tank on a motorcycle? Shit was off the hook.

Sprite
03-03-2010, 08:35 AM
I accuse Motorcycle-Bear.

Dizzy
03-03-2010, 08:39 AM
This thread is like a locker room now. Can't you all keep it in the gym?

dtsund
03-03-2010, 08:41 AM
Man, the East game! Could you believe it when that bear jumped a shark tank on a motorcycle? Shit was off the hook.

You guys have jumped the shark already? At least the West game's still interesting.

Brickroad
03-03-2010, 08:45 AM
Man, the East game! Could you believe it when that bear jumped a shark tank on a motorcycle? Shit was off the hook.

SPOILERZ: I was the bear... and the motorcycle.

LilSprite was the shark. Eddie was Batman.

Tock
03-03-2010, 08:50 AM
It's almost enough to make me de-lurk permanently...

Do it. One of us. One of us.

Alpha Werewolf
03-03-2010, 09:53 AM
I don't know what's this shit about not reasdig the other thread. I'm doing fine reading both.

THIS JUST IN: The Easties lynched a deaf vannila townie on day 1.

Phantoon
03-03-2010, 10:06 AM
We think it's potentially metagaming and I've found it's actually funnier to pick up hints as to what's going on in this thread instead. Then when we're done I'll read the whole thing start to finish.

Alpha Werewolf
03-03-2010, 10:08 AM
What's so bad about metagaming? Knowing how a player usually plays can give you an edge when he's still an unknown.

vaterite
03-03-2010, 10:09 AM
You guys have jumped the shark already? At least the West game's still interesting.

Didn't we nuke the fridge?

Alpha Werewolf
03-03-2010, 10:15 AM
I am, personally, interested in the other game right now ^_^

Also: If the mafia of either game are worried about that method you mentioned, I'd expect them to just log in as anonymous. Plus the makes some people who keep the site open all day unjustly suspicious, and is generally not a reliable method.

kaisel
03-03-2010, 10:18 AM
I think the other potential problem with reading and commenting on the other game while they're still going on is like what happened toward the end of the first mafia game in this thread, where talk was dangerously close (though I think it actually crossed the line a bit) to discussion about the game. Players in Mafia West might pick up on things players in Mafia East don't and vice versa and that can change the tenor and strategy of the game.

The whole Marion/Silent Noise thing and knowing Marion's role gives me knowledge about what role Silent Noise probably had due to probability and the like, and it's something that's going to affect how I play the game.

Alpha Werewolf
03-03-2010, 10:23 AM
If Merus feels like we're threatening the purity of the game, he can say so. Otherwise, I see no reason to pass up.

Tock
03-03-2010, 10:57 AM
I'm not sure what you're playing at, Alpha Werewolf, whose name is related to the Werewolf game, which is just another version of Mafia.

I accuse Alpha Mafia

Alpha Werewolf
03-03-2010, 10:58 AM
I'm not sure what you're playing at, Alpha Werewolf, whose name is related to the Werewolf game, which is just another version of Mafia.

I accuse Alpha Mafia

Trivia time! My name is actually related to the online "free"(meaning you only get a quarter of the content without paying) game AdventureQuest.

Tock
03-03-2010, 10:59 AM
Trivia time! My name is actually related to the online "free"(meaning you only get a quarter of the content without paying) game AdventureQuest.

So long as your name is not associated with the free online game Evony, my lord.

Destil
03-03-2010, 11:28 AM
So long as your name is not associated with the free online game Evony, my lord.

Not enough cleavage in his avatar.

Alpha Werewolf
03-03-2010, 11:31 AM
Not enough cleavage in his avatar.

Indeed.

And by the way, the day my avatar changes is the day I make sprites again. Or the day I get banned.

In other words, never.

Merus
03-03-2010, 12:15 PM
If Merus feels like we're threatening the purity of the game, he can say so. Otherwise, I see no reason to pass up.

I'll admit: last game I was definitely using this thread as a substitute to manipulate the mafia, so I'll be wise to people's shenanigans.

kaisel
03-03-2010, 12:26 PM
I'll admit: last game I was definitely using this thread as a substitute to manipulate the mafia, so I'll be wise to people's shenanigans.

You have no idea how difficult it was to craft a response saying "please don't do this" and not seem like mafia. Hence why I didn't post anything when it got to an annoying point.

I suppose I should have just PMed dtsund to be honest

Alpha Werewolf
03-03-2010, 12:29 PM
I'll be straight up with you and say your avatar is the sole reason I chose you as the initial random accusation.

Wait. Is that good or bad?

Sprite
03-03-2010, 12:50 PM
You're wondering if it's bad that your avatar made Nich want to kill you?

Umby
03-03-2010, 02:20 PM
T_T

Oh yeah, lynch the caught up with schoolwork kid. Good going, guys. I gave you good reasons and everything. Ah well, at least I'm off the hook for this game. I hope you win.

SuperRube
03-03-2010, 02:41 PM
Yeah, whatever deafy.

Tanto
03-03-2010, 04:29 PM
Yeah, whatever deafy.

It's funny because he can't hear you!

Mr. J
03-03-2010, 04:30 PM
Westies talk like this:
You see that man? He is Mafia, and will not live to see another day.

Easties talk like this:
You see that man? He is Mafia. Let us consider killing him. Maybe. If it won't hurt anyone's feelings, and after thinking it over for a few days.


Man too true. I think that is the longest day 1 I have ever seen. Sorry Umby :(

Also we should rename this the mafia trash talking thread.

Nerdy
03-03-2010, 04:34 PM
It's funny because he can't hear you!

But he can read!

Destil
03-03-2010, 04:50 PM
T_T

Oh yeah, lynch the caught up with schoolwork kid. Good going, guys. I gave you good reasons and everything. Ah well, at least I'm off the hook for this game. I hope you win.You're still on team citizen. I hope we win, Umby. I hope we win.

I mean, wouldn't you suspect someone who, even when seated next to conductor's car never heard a thing?

Brickroad
03-03-2010, 08:27 PM
It's funny because he can't hear you!

i lol'd

dtsund
03-03-2010, 11:46 PM
Welp, guess I get to read both threads now.

Umby
03-04-2010, 05:17 PM
You're still on team citizen. I hope we win, Umby. I hope we win.

I mean, wouldn't you suspect someone who, even when seated next to conductor's car never heard a thing?


Unless you're MAFIA

Nah. I don't even really care, brah. I hope we win! I'll be rooting from the sidelines/bottom of the cliff!

Comb Stranger
03-04-2010, 06:44 PM
So Umby still holds the record, having been murdered three times in two games. Congrats!

SuperRube
03-04-2010, 06:51 PM
He should be lynched, killed by the mafia, two vigilantes, and the shotgun granny from that one website totally devoted to the mafia game that has way too many special roles.

The granny's only role will be to kill umby in that game, however. After that she goes back to being a citizen.

Brickroad
03-04-2010, 07:00 PM
We also need a new role, Suicide Cultist, which will be assigned specifically to Umby.

Destil
03-04-2010, 07:03 PM
I've been running some ideas for rules though my mind today. One was a vigilante who begins the game with two shotgun shells. He spends a shell to kill someone, and can kill up to two people a night (double barrel); but only gets an extra shell on the 3rd, 6th, 9th et cetera nights (or maybe if he kills a mafia member).

Now, of course, I have to add the ability to kill the same player twice. As long as that player is Umby.

SuperRube
03-04-2010, 07:14 PM
We also need a new role, Suicide Cultist, which will be assigned specifically to Umby.

Wait, would the cultist target Umby, or would he be Umby?

You've really got to iron these details out in advance or things can get real embarrassing real quick.

Brickroad
03-04-2010, 07:16 PM
Wait, would the cultist target Umby, or would he be Umby?

You've really got to iron these details out in advance or things can get real embarrassing real quick.

No no, Umby would be the Suicide Cultist.

Suicide Cultist (new citizen role)
- The Suicide Cultist has the ability to kill him or herself during Night Phase.
- The Suicide Cultist must use his or her ability during the first Night Phase.

Sprite
03-04-2010, 07:20 PM
Oh, and don't forget the Insane Angel, who can protect one person a night, and then kill them.

Gredlen
03-04-2010, 07:22 PM
Double Suicidal Cultist

The Double Suicidal Cultist has the ability to kill him or herself during Night Phase.
The Double Suicidal Cultist must use his or her ability during the first Night Phase.
The Double Suicidal Cultist gets lynched before the first Night Phase.


Silent Noise gets to be the Double Suicidal Cultist.

dtsund
03-04-2010, 08:45 PM
By the way, Merus? Are you looking for a replacement for the East game?

*raises hand*

I feel like those klutzes could use all the help they can get.

Eddie
03-04-2010, 09:10 PM
You know, I was thinking that maybe we should try a game that has NO special roles in it sometime. Just plain ol' citizens, mafioso, and tons of paranoia.

- Eddie

Sprite
03-04-2010, 09:11 PM
We don't need any Westrals stinking up our turf!

Destil
03-04-2010, 09:16 PM
You know, I was thinking that maybe we should try a game that has NO special roles in it sometime. Just plain ol' citizens, mafioso, and tons of paranoia.

- Eddie

I was thinking allow the roles (maybe reduced in number), but remove all factual knowledge. You don't know anything but who died each morning. No reveals of roles upon death, no knowing who did what in the night. That's really an uphill battle for the good guys, though.

Now that would be paranoia. Throw in a rule that we need to vote to end the game and tweak the win conditions a bit so the citizens can screw themselves over in the end, too...

Brickroad
03-04-2010, 10:30 PM
ARGH

I hate shivam SO MUCH.

Okay I don't really, but still, ARGH.