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Kirin
06-03-2007, 11:08 AM
So, I've finally got a chance to start in on it, and just made it to the start of Valkyrie chapter 3. I'm relieved to see more bags finally for sale (limited slots puts such a crimp on the alchemy system) but dismayed by the cost per slot, since money is so damn hard to come by. I noted that it looks like I could make some money very slowly by wandering back and forth in completed levels collecting and selling mandragoras, but man that would be tedious. Any other tips?

Also, does anyone know if the difficulty level makes any difference in terms of available rewards in the levels, or unlocks later in the game? I'm on medium and constantly feel like I'm hanging on by the skin of my teeth. I invariably have to throw every single attack and defense item I have at level bosses, and most of them at mid-bosses as well.

Basically, if I wimped out and went to Easy, would I miss cool stuff, or would I have more fun because I'd get higher ranks and hence more coins and hence be able to expand my inventory and play more with alchemy and what-not?

Alternately, I've never actually used the "return home and reset the level" option either - does that end up giving you a lot more to work with? I've never been sure whether it'd be a net win, since I seem to use up resources as fast as I can create them anyway.

All that indecision aside, I'm loving the game. And yeah, so pretty.

Kishi
06-03-2007, 12:03 PM
My strategy for making money has been to run through completed areas with a focus on the sections that feature G as the prominent reward. (Check your area map to see which sections offer which rewards, of course.) If you have any spare room, it also helps a bit to hold on to any items you get that you know you won't use to sell to the nearest merchant.

Fortunately, the need for gold-farming diminishes as the game progresses, as it seems like the amount of G you earn gradually increases. Either that, or I've just become more discreet with my spending. (I'll gladly pass on an accessory that increases attack power by ten percent now that I know there'll be one that increases it by thirty percent later on, for instance.)

alexb
06-03-2007, 12:08 PM
I farm sheep plants and Muggle fruits for cash. I'm in the same chapter as you. I'm building up to afford the Freeze Charm. It seems pretty essentially with all those frost-breathing yetis in the mountains.

shivam
06-03-2007, 12:43 PM
nah. you can make potions that are much cheaper and just as effective as those ridiculous charms.

alexb
06-03-2007, 12:52 PM
Not at this point. I can make Warming Potions, but that doesn't keep me from being encased in a block of ice while a bunch of inbred chimps beat my most tender parts.

Coinspinner
06-03-2007, 02:02 PM
It came in a while back. I was quickly reminded that I suck at action games of any kind. Playing Etrian instead. :x

spineshark
06-03-2007, 02:44 PM
nah. you can make potions that are much cheaper and just as effective as those ridiculous charms.
My brother made it look like the charm made you immune to the Freeze status as well as the cold level damage, but I don't know if it's actually true.

I love this game, but I've made it to Oswald's epilogue and I think I need to take a few days off since I've suffered slight burnout (what really happened is, I almost *need* more Carroteers, but don't want to go out of my way to get them). When lack of skills combines with tedious alternatives, I sure as hell don't win.

Jakanden
06-03-2007, 02:48 PM
I am about 8 hours in myself (Act 3 of Pooka Prince) and still loving the hell out of it. I cannot wait for Oswald's campaign.

Eusis
06-03-2007, 03:57 PM
In the mail since Fry's sold out when I went, just went and ordered it off of Amazon. I think it'll be here tomorrow actually.

locit
06-03-2007, 04:43 PM
I'm having a great time just sort of taking it in little chunks at a time (now about where Jakanden is). I'm trying to avoid burnout because I think I'm prone to it in this sort of game. I love it though, and the story is really playing out in an interesting way.

A few people I've talked to really seem to have a grudge against the game though- mostly citing 'gaudy' art style, repetitiveness, and how the story is too overtly 'tragic'.

Jakanden
06-03-2007, 04:49 PM
I'm having a great time just sort of taking it in little chunks at a time (now about where Jakanden is). I'm trying to avoid burnout because I think I'm prone to it in this sort of game. I love it though, and the story is really playing out in an interesting way.

A few people I've talked to really seem to have a grudge against the game though- mostly citing 'gaudy' art style, repetitiveness, and how the story is too overtly 'tragic'.

I also play it in spurts of one act at a time for the same reason.

doc_marten_abortion
06-03-2007, 08:17 PM
Granted, the game is gorgeous. But, I'm not finding anything outside of the aesthetics interesting or fun. I've given it about five hours of my time; hope that just means I haven't found the meat yet? Anyone?

Or is this one that requires you to bite immediately?

Stephen
06-03-2007, 08:38 PM
A few people I've talked to really seem to have a grudge against the game though- mostly citing 'gaudy' art style, repetitiveness, and how the story is too overtly 'tragic'.

I wouldn't say that's "a grudge" since two of those three complaints are completely valid. The art is amazing, I can't believe there are people who don't like it. The rest of the game though...

I'm three stages into the the Pooka story and I've done nothing but replay the same stages as I did with the Valkyrie. Even the bosses have been the same (one appeared in a different stage, but it was an identical fight). If the rest of the stories all take place in the same 8 locations with the same 4 or 5 enemy types per stage, I'd say that's pretty damn repetitive. Toss in the button mashing game play and you've got yourself repetitive deluxe, especially over what appears to be a 30+ hour game.

I understand why it's like that though. The backgrounds have tons of layers and are very meticulously constructed, so it would be crazy to expect every character to get entirely new content. Still, playing through the same areas over and over is pretty boring, especially if you happen to enjoy exploring (I do). No matter how pretty the scenery is, recycle it too many times and it gets old.

Also, the writing is quite melodramatic. The speech Gwendolyn gives at the end of her epilogue is an especially glaring example of this. It's well written, to be sure, but it's teetering on the precipice of being way too over the top for my taste.

I want to like this game so much it hurts. I love the sprites (when they aren't caught in hideous slowdown mode) and I love the art design. I'm very interested to see how the stories will intertwine and I'm happy I bought it, if just to show support for the 2D cause. Overall though, it's a very mediocre game in an extremely flattering dress.

Jakanden
06-03-2007, 08:41 PM
Granted, the game is gorgeous. But, I'm not finding anything outside of the aesthetics interesting or fun. I've given it about five hours of my time; hope that just means I haven't found the meat yet? Anyone?

Or is this one that requires you to bite immediately?

On the previous thread from the now-dead version of TT, it seemed to be one of those games you either enjoyed right away or didn't enjoy it at all. If it hasn't grabbed you by now, it likely won't.

alexb
06-03-2007, 08:43 PM
I thought the English track sucked so I turned on Japanese. That kind of helps because I'm trying to pick out phrases I know, which makes it a sort of meta game. But this isn't an exploration game. It's a combat and alchemy game.

Stephen
06-03-2007, 08:48 PM
Yeah but the combat ain't that great (it's basically a 16-bit beat 'em up) and you aren't allowed to experiment with the alchemy, which is lame.

Edit to add: Yeah, I know it's not an exploration game, but Super Mario 2 had more location variety and only takes 40 min to finish.

alexb
06-04-2007, 12:01 AM
Well, tastes differ. I'm having a pretty good time with it. I can't believe somebody would say the art is gaudy, though. This is shit straight out of the Golden Age of Illustration here. I've counted 7 and 8 layers of parallax at points. That's nuts. And the effects they used to animate Brigan were impressive. Reminded me of Howl's Moving Castle. Anyone who would fault the game's aesthetic is not someone whose opinion I would put stock in.

Makkara
06-04-2007, 02:42 AM
I was kind of disappointed that the game has absolutely no exploration whatsoever. Sure, you move from sphere to sphere, but they're all exactly alike. Sadness.

I got over that, though. It's a fun beat 'em up that looks like a painting come to life. The alchemy is a bit of a chore, but I enjoy planting and eating fruits and meat. B+, or something.

Sean
06-04-2007, 08:44 AM
I've barely had time to play it, but the music and art has astonished me in ways few games have in years. I hate to hear so many people say it's "same-y," but I think I'll be fine with it from what I've seen so far.

Idiot Moment: I spent 20 minutes trying to figure out how to equip an item from within the item bags... haha. For some reason the whole Item Ring thing just never came to mind. I hate myself sometimes.

djSyndrome
06-04-2007, 08:53 AM
Nothing like feeding a baby chick three seeds just to slaughter it once it's full-grown.

(I wanted to pick it up and toss it into a fence, a la LttP, but no dice).

Kolbe
06-05-2007, 10:33 AM
I'm in the third chapter of Gwen's story too, and while its a gorgeous-looking game, it can be quite repetitive. The best way to deal with this kind of games, in my opinion, is to play it once in a while and make it last, instead of trying to beat it ASAP or something.

Jakanden
06-05-2007, 11:40 AM
I'm in the third chapter of Gwen's story too, and while its a gorgeous-looking game, it can be quite repetitive. The best way to deal with this kind of games, in my opinion, is to play it once in a while and make it last, instead of trying to beat it ASAP or something.

Agreed. I can only put in about an hour or so at a time. While that does sound negative and a slight against the game, I still think it was worth paying full price for and I do enjoy it.

tungwene
06-05-2007, 11:41 AM
My brother made it look like the charm made you immune to the Freeze status as well as the cold level damage, but I don't know if it's actually true.Ice proof charm protects against both. I know this because I was getting my ass kicked so badly by Chapter 4's boss of Cornelius' arc that I hightailed it back to my home base to earn money for a fire proof charm. You don't suffer from cold damage during that boss fight stage, which was fortunate for me because I was wearing my ice proof charm all the way up to the peak of the mountain and thus hadn't bothered to bring any Warming potions with me, but the little snowflakes kept freezing me into blocks of ice, which wasn't that much better than running around to put out my fire.

Yeah, I'm pretty much head over heels in love with this game by this point. The game doesn't feel repetitive to me because I breeze through a stage so quickly in each characters story that it feels like I've barely spent any time in each area so it doesn't bother me when I have to visit again. Some boss battles are easy for some characters but the same boss can be super hard another character. Also, I'm just totally geeked out about the phozon system. I usually hate games that have system that force you to expend your EXP for things other than leveling up or can cause you to lose EXP, because it feels like no matter what choice I make I'm screwing myself over. Odin Sphere's phozon system has this awesome circle of life feel to it that's really deep and well thought out and never do I feel like I'm shorting myself.

And I like the story. Each story by itself isn't very special but I really love the way all five of them fit and intertwine with one another.

tungwene
06-06-2007, 11:19 PM
I'm in Cornelius' epilogue right now. Any one know how to kill the green amoeba things with ghost faces that creep along the ground and then wrap around you and suck away your HP? Normal attacks don't work at all and I tried Phozon Blasting them but that didn't do anything either.

Kirin
06-07-2007, 10:37 AM
Word on the *twitch* gfaqs boards is that you basically have to use potions on them. If you don't have any attack potions available, to the down+X attack until they drop a chest with a potion.

Apparently this only applies to Cornelius, though; other characters seem to have attacks that can damage them. I haven't gotten far enough to verify. In theory hitting them while frog'd also works.

tungwene
06-07-2007, 05:38 PM
Apparently this only applies to Cornelius, though; other characters seem to have attacks that can damage them. I haven't gotten far enough to verify. In theory hitting them while frog'd also works.That's a relief. I hate carrying around attack potions because you can only use them once unlike support potions which come in three portions per bottle which to me is just a waste of space. Got to the last battle of the Epilogue. The slowdown is so awful that I can be standing quite a ways away from the fruity dragon eating something to heal myself and in the time it takes me to do that he sucks me right in his mouth rendering my last action useless.

Savathun
06-07-2007, 05:48 PM
I'm on Chapter Five with Gwendolyn now. I don't know if I'll be able to finish the game before I have to take it back, but it's pretty interesting. I don't know about anyone else, but I never block. If it were another button, maybe I would, but I just don't think of it when it's bound to the same button as my attack.

Oh, and Odin's really kind of a son of a bitch. Guess you can't be that big and still be a nice guy or something.

alexb
06-07-2007, 07:38 PM
I usually just keep the button held down after I feel I've over extended myself using a combo. It sometimes saves me from damage I can't outright dodge.

Calorie Mate
06-07-2007, 08:11 PM
This game is sitting on my shelf back home, still in the shrink wrap, while I'm stuck here in Vegas. Then I'm leaving for DC for two weeks.

All I want to do is play Odin Sphere, but stupid hotel TVs won't allow me to hook up my PS2, and thus I have to wait.

jovewolf
06-07-2007, 08:24 PM
This game is sitting on my shelf back home, still in the shrink wrap, while I'm stuck here in Vegas. Then I'm leaving for DC for two weeks.

All I want to do is play Odin Sphere, but stupid hotel TVs won't allow me to hook up my PS2, and thus I have to wait.

I picked up a cheap portable DVD player with composite input for just such an occasion.

Mostly because I'll be living in hotels for the next month or two.

As for Odin Sphere, it's caught in a bidding war with a few other games I'm playing, like Etrian and Zone of the Enders 2, which I finally found used at an EBstop. Still I rather enjoy the game, except that it really likes to kick my ass.

Calorie Mate
06-07-2007, 08:35 PM
I picked up a cheap portable DVD player with composite input for just such an occasion.

Mostly because I'll be living in hotels for the next month or two.

As for Odin Sphere, it's caught in a bidding war with a few other games I'm playing, like Etrian and Zone of the Enders 2, which I finally found used at an EBstop. Still I rather enjoy the game, except that it really likes to kick my ass.

"Cheap" meaning how much, exactly? I have three days to solve this dilemma, or it's nothing but my DS for the next two weeks.

jovewolf
06-07-2007, 08:49 PM
Well I found one at Best Buy for about $70, but I think I got the mid-size screen at 8" widescreen. I think they had a smaller cheaper one there, but I can't remember if it had the inputs. It was about $50 though.

I figured it's about the cost of 2 PS2 games that I could do without or trade in for or something, but your milage may vary. Or you could get lucky and find a better deal.

MechaX
06-07-2007, 11:07 PM
Managed to get Odin Sphere with my temporarily unemployed ass (Well, that and a forgotten victory Ebay-Bid for Final Fantasy IV Advance, which I was hoping was VI when I first saw it), and here are my short impressions on it so far.

I've only managed to get past the first actual boss fight with that dragon, but so far, I'm having mixed feelings. In an objective sense, I can see that the game itself is really good. Interesting premise, and glamorous graphics. However, I'm not having nearly as much of a blast with it as I thought I would, and I could probably blame that on the overwhelming hype it got subsequent to the Play review. That could be due to the fact that I'm juggling my Tales of the Abyss 2nd replay, Valkyrie Profile, and now Final Fantasy IV and I'm haphazardly trying to force OS into things.

But... I don't know... The game just hasn't... clicked with me so far, and I usually love 2D games of all assortments, whether they be good Mega Man games, Castlevania games, Metroid games, shumups, etc. And when comparing that to the time I'm having with VP (Intense hatred for some game mechanics coupled with intense love for the things it does correctly), I'm silently wishing that I had gotten Valkyrie Profile 2: Silmeria or Final Fantasy VI Advance.

Oh well, I'm only about an hour into the game, so maybe it'll spark my involvement as it continues.

Savathun
06-07-2007, 11:40 PM
Yeah, I just found ZOE2 used at Gamestop, too. I just wish everyone didn't sound like they were having seizures when they said "Jehuty."

Bah, and now, on Odin Sphere, I'm stuck on Mercedes. I really hope this game has a cool last boss, though. They can obviously do big and pretty monsters, so I'm expecting much.

jovewolf
06-07-2007, 11:47 PM
Yeah, I just found ZOE2 used at Gamestop, too. I just wish everyone didn't sound like they were having seizures when they said "Jehuty."

Bah, and now, on Odin Sphere, I'm stuck on Mercedes. I really hope this game has a cool last boss, though. They can obviously do big and pretty monsters, so I'm expecting much.

Agreed about the Jehuty thing. It might be alright for ADA, but geez everyone just spits out those syllables.

Still though - the Vic Viper fight is love.

I'm still stuck in Gwendolen in Odin Sphere at the moment. I keep dying when I go through the story, so I'm wandering around the woods and mountain to build up my stash. I really need to put some more time into it.

Savathun
06-07-2007, 11:51 PM
The first time I fought Vic Vyper, I wasn't a Gradius fan, so I was thinking "Why does that sound so familiar?"

Now, though... even the music makes me geek out. And he has options! Oh, he has options.

My problem with Odin Sphere is that I use all my phozons on seeds. I should be levelling up my Psypher or just getting stuff stockpiled for Phozon Blast, but no, I keep growing trees. Especially those stupid Napple ones that take forever.

Oh, and anyone else crack up on the "Princess, I'm a Pooka merchant" part?

ArugulaZ
06-07-2007, 11:56 PM
You guys have any problems running this on a high-def television set? I've got a 32" TV that goes up to 1080i and the picture shimmers whenever the screen scrolls. Evidently the developers didn't bother to include a progressive scan mode for a game they knew would be lauded for its striking visuals. Bad move, Atlus!

JR

alexb
06-08-2007, 01:22 AM
Don't play it in 1080i. You're interlacing the image twice, effectively.

ArugulaZ
06-08-2007, 02:55 AM
I didn't know I had a choice in the matter. Are there any options in Odin Sphere or the PS2 itself that would let me force the game to default to 480p?

JR

Kishi
06-08-2007, 12:14 PM
I've only managed to get past the first actual boss fight with that dragon, but so far, I'm having mixed feelings.

At that point, you've only experienced a fraction of the gameplay. Just wait until you're spawning sheep, feeding chickens, uprooting mandragoras, mixing potions, and compiling recipes for the kitchen and cafe. I think you'll come around.

djSyndrome
06-08-2007, 12:37 PM
Don't play it in 1080i. You're interlacing the image twice, effectively.

If you have a 720p/1080i LCD set, remove the 1080i option from the output options. You have no reason to set the PS3 in 1080i mode now that Blu-Ray discs play at 720p.

At that point, you've only experienced a fraction of the gameplay. Just wait until you're spawning sheep, feeding chickens, uprooting mandragoras, mixing potions, and compiling recipes for the kitchen and cafe. I think you'll come around.

I've done all of those things and I'm still not horribly impressed. Yes, the game's beautiful. No, I can't get past the repetition.

spineshark
06-08-2007, 01:47 PM
Yeah, my feeling is that the gameplay is a little lean relative to the amount of story they wanted to have. So the solution they used is to repeat the same gameplay segments a lot. While each character controls fairly differently, it's still really repetitive. I don't know whether I would like a marathon of cutscenes all over the place better though. Really, the game would be so much better paced if they just took out say, two or so chapters from each character. Preferably the ones where your character sucks against the enemies.

Savathun
06-08-2007, 02:44 PM
Does anyone have any tips on beating Odette? I mean, is there some clever trick or is she just ungodly hard?

spineshark
06-08-2007, 02:58 PM
Do you have any Painkillers? At least the first five books are no sweat as long as you're willing to abuse every potion you can make. Anyway I assume you're still on Gwen's story, so all you can make is Painkiller, but as long as you have decent HP and keep smacking her... Also, depending on your Psypher level you should have Overload, hopefully, if not Shadow Ally, which seems to be the most powerful spell in the game. And uhh, that move where she gets out the spider legs and heals herself is by far the most annoying she has. It seems like you can *usually* knock her out of it with Phozon Burst, but not always. You just have to hope she doesn't use it a lot of times in succession.

Kishi
06-08-2007, 02:58 PM
This only counts as a "clever trick" if you've been glossing over the alchemy system, but it sounds to me like you need some Painkiller. Mix a Material (0) with a couple seeds or something to produce a Material (2), then mix that with a Cubsbane to procure three shots of the good stuff. Fortunately for you, Cubsbane is particularly easy to find in Endelphia, since it's needed for mixing Shine.

If it's really bad, Heal Potion can also be an enormous help. That's a Material (0) and a Carrotteer.

Savathun
06-08-2007, 03:06 PM
Aah, painkiller! You know, I forgot all about that. I've mostly been using alchemy for the healing potions and Shines, but I forgot about everything else. Plus I spent waaaaaaaay too much time buying take out at the pooka cafes, which is great and all, but I burned through them in the dungeon.

I've been using Overload and just wailing on her, but yeah, that blasted spider leg business just makes it impossible. I was pretty much at a stalemate for a while there. Thanks.

tungwene
06-08-2007, 04:55 PM
Also, if you have any Chicken Bones, Grape Stems, Napple Cores, etc. to throw I think you can stun her right as she's about to perform an attack like kicking out her legs. Napalm works just as well.

spineshark
06-08-2007, 09:35 PM
It's also worth noting though that bones are also worth an awesome +3 to material numbers. Certainly feel free to chuck them if you want, but they're certainly more valuable than the other trash items-Grape Stems and Napple Cores only give +1.

ArugulaZ
06-08-2007, 11:05 PM
If you have a 720p/1080i LCD set, remove the 1080i option from the output options. You have no reason to set the PS3 in 1080i mode now that Blu-Ray discs play at 720p.

Er, I'm playing it on a Playstation 2, not a Playstation 3. Are there any options for someone like myself?

JR

Deadguy2322
06-09-2007, 07:29 AM
Er, I'm playing it on a Playstation 2, not a Playstation 3. Are there any options for someone like myself?

JR

Buy a PS3? :P

ArugulaZ
06-09-2007, 12:48 PM
Buy a PS3? :P

Hmf. I'll learn to live with it, then.

JR

alexb
06-09-2007, 02:35 PM
Hmf. I'll learn to live with it, then.

JR

Don't listen to him. You've got a viable option here in the form of the XPloder HDTV Player (http://www.xploder.net/ps2/products/148/Xploder-HDTV-Player.htm). I had a thread about this same issue in the old forum. Anyway, what this thing does is essentially force interlaced games to display in a progressive scan video mode. It doesn't work on all games, but it does work on many, including Odin Sphere, which I tested before I recommended this option to you. All the extra modes like the so-called 720p widescreen mode and the 1080i are stupid and not worth your time, but 480p works as advertised. It eliminates the chunky line-doubling effect you see in interlaced games on fixed-pixel HD sets (LCD and Plasma) as well as the combing effect when things blink, like you've described in Odin Sphere. The downside is that it uses the entire 720p field to render a 480i game in 480p. Meaning that you can't use it on widescreen games. Beyond that, the image is a bit wider than what it would have been originally, but not to the point of looking noticeably distorted.

I used it to play Devil Summoner a few months back. That game looked pretty bad on my HD set, but I found it to be quite acceptable with the XPloder disc. This is a possible solution for you, though you may have to look around a bit to find it these days. You can order it directly from its makers in the UK, but that's 20 (~$40 US) plus international shipping. That's still better than buying a PS3 that still outputs an interlaced game. I would argue that a game bumped up to progressive scan using this disc looks superior to an upscaled game on the PS3. The PS3's filters do reduce the appearance of line doubling, but combing remains an issue. Anyway, I bought my copy of the disc from a local EB back in February for about $30, but it doesn't appear to be showing up on their website anymore. The package comes with a component cable, if you don't already have one. If I were you, I'd check my local stores for it first.

ArugulaZ
06-09-2007, 02:40 PM
Thanks! You've been quite helpful, and I appreciate the advice.

JR

djSyndrome
06-11-2007, 10:37 AM
So I've decided to give this game another chance. I finished Gwendolyn's book last night and was satisfied with the conclusion. I'm still not thrilled with the emphasis this game is placing on alchemy and cooking - I would have liked more emphasis on the combat engine and less slowdown during some boss fights.

But the storytelling is second-to-none, and that's the reason I'll work my way through it.

tungwene
06-11-2007, 09:21 PM
I think Mercedes is by far my favorite character to play as so far. The only downside to her is she's got way too little HP. I spent nearly four hours grinding just to get her past Oswald (stupid fairies kept healing him). I'm really happy the Pooka Village opens up in chapter 3 for her. I was able to double her HP in the half hour with the Pooka Kitchen.

djSyndrome
06-12-2007, 08:44 AM
Apparently someone doesn't like Odin Sphere too much (http://blog.wired.com/games/2007/06/review_odin_sph.html#more).

reibeatall
06-12-2007, 09:29 AM
You, like my friends, might be so taken with Odin Sphere's originality that you will be able to forgive its flaws. But if I had to play either Odin Sphere or Dawn of Mana, I'd choose the latter -- which is saying something.


O_O!!!!

Wha?

Torgo
06-12-2007, 09:33 AM
Oh it's on.

(Now I'm mad I used the Saddam bobblehead yesterday, because it would work so much better here.)

djSyndrome
06-12-2007, 09:59 AM
I'm surprised he didn't mention the slowdown. Oh my god, the slowdown.

openedsource
06-12-2007, 10:48 AM
I picked up a cheap portable DVD player with composite input for just such an occasion.


You need to Benheck (http://benheck.com/) that sumbitch and make yourself a PS2 Portable.

Sadly, I haven't found or been able to make time to play this game, so I've been watching a sibling tear through (backseat gaming - use the spell! Plant a seed!) and trying to follow the thread.

Obviously I haven't seen quite enough of the game - when I read "Do you have any Painkillers?" in response to Brandon's query, I interpreted that as "do you have any aspirin? Because you're pretty much S.O.L. in-game."

ArugulaZ
06-12-2007, 12:36 PM
So I've decided to give this game another chance. I finished Gwendolyn's book last night and was satisfied with the conclusion.

How long does it take to finish her story? I'm already six hours in and I'm eager to start playing as another hero (preferably one that doesn't take seven years to swing a weapon). I thought it would have been finished when I took out Gwen's father, but there's still more!

Kohler needs to play Princess Crown for a while. I felt the same way he did, but then I went back to Crown and realized just how greatly improved Odin Sphere really is.

JR

djSyndrome
06-12-2007, 12:43 PM
How long does it take to finish her story? I'm already six hours in and I'm eager to start playing as another hero (preferably one that doesn't take seven years to swing a weapon).

My clock showed about 7 hours when I finished up Gwendolyn's book. I spent about an hour grinding in total, and way too much time finishing most boss fights. If you've beaten Odin you're over halfway there, IIRC.

Kishi
06-12-2007, 12:47 PM
Each book seems to have seven chapters, including the prologue and epilogue, so you can gauge your progress accordingly.

tungwene
06-12-2007, 02:52 PM
I think Gwen took me 11 hours to complete. The other two stories I've touched on so far are going by much faster. I think it's a combination of not having any idea what I was doing and the fact that stuff like the Pooka Village opens up earlier and earlier with each successive story.

SDMX
06-13-2007, 01:47 AM
Oh it's on.

(Now I'm mad I used the Saddam bobblehead yesterday, because it would work so much better here.)

Don't worry, Torgo; We gotcha covered up ins. Snappy celebrity dictators and everything:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v87/somniamagus/4655bc207ee58db42811336d3b260ac6.gif

tungwene
06-13-2007, 07:30 AM
Spoilers for Cornelius and Mercedes storylines: Serves Ingway right he was turned into a frog after turning me into a Pooka in Cornelius' story. Schadenfreude tastes sweet as well End Spoiler.

I beat Mercedes story last night. I'm absolutely in love with playing as her. After her bow becomes insanely overpowered in the epilogue she nigh unstoppable.

bobservo
06-16-2007, 09:56 AM
I just got the game from GameFly, and they unfortunately don't have a scanned manual for me to check out. I'd rely on the game's tutorial for information, but they neglect to tell you a lot of vital information, such as where Exp. points come from (I eventually figured this out). So I have just a few questions:

-What do the stars next to different levels on the map mean?
-And how about those item icons on the map? I assume you can win said items if you do well enough in a level, but I haven't seen a connection yet.
-Can you go back and upgrade your score in a level to get better treasure.

I'm only two hours in, and while I'm enjoying the game I still have a few prolems with it. I agree with Kohler that the action is too zoomed-in. This isn't a problem with enemies, but when a boss comes along I find myself playing Metal Gear Solid 2-style by looking exclusively at the mini-map. At this point the game seems like it has the chance to become really repetitive, but DAMN is it pretty.

reibeatall
06-16-2007, 09:59 AM
The stars indicate how many enemies/how hard it is. If it's a 5 star, then you sould expect 3 waves of enemies; a 3 star is 2 waves, and a 1 star is 1 wave.

You get the item that's showing no matter what your rank is, however, a better rank gets you MORE items in the treasure chest.

You can go back and upgrade your score for better/more treasure, and you can also gain levels that way.

upupdowndown
06-16-2007, 10:29 AM
You can go back and upgrade your score for better/more treasure, and you can also gain levels that way.

*delurks, making a sound like when a Romulan ship de-cloaks*

If you're looking to grind, grind, grind your way to domination, the way to do it is to press start and choose the "Home" option. It'll start you back at your home base with all experience and items you've earned from the level, allowing you to go through the level again fresh. Once you've beaten a stage in a level, you won't be able to redo it unless you leave the level.

ArugulaZ
06-18-2007, 03:42 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zwly7PGoS9U

You would not believe the time I invested in this review. Who knew that it took a dozen hours to create four minutes of footage?

Anyway, give 'er a look and let me know what you think. As you can probably tell from the review, I'm a little more fond of the game now that I've spent more time with it.

JR

Jakanden
06-18-2007, 05:45 PM
I started playing it again over the weekend and I am now halfway through Mercedes story.

I also ordered the PSP version (http://www.play-asia.com/paOS-13-71-9f-49-en-15-Princess%2Bcrown-70-1s0m.html) of Princess Crown after hearing Mielke talk about it on the 1up yours podcast. I had no idea it had been released for PSP or I would have gotten it sooner.

mr_bungle700
06-18-2007, 06:34 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zwly7PGoS9U

You would not believe the time I invested in this review. Who knew that it took a dozen hours to create four minutes of footage?

Anyway, give 'er a look and let me know what you think. As you can probably tell from the review, I'm a little more fond of the game now that I've spent more time with it.

JR

That review was pretty good! Funny too. Nice work.

ArugulaZ
06-18-2007, 09:24 PM
Thanks, I appreciate the compliments! I decided to make this video after seeing all the YouTube members out there desperately trying to be the next Angry Video Game Nerd. I've seen that guy's work. The Angry Video Game Nerd is not someone you want to be, unless your greatest goal in life is to be boring and profane.

JR

Sarcasmorator
06-19-2007, 12:42 AM
AAA+++ would wathc again!!1

Seriously, that's an entertaining and informative video review.

reibeatall
06-19-2007, 09:30 AM
I second the comments already made, but my one thing about it is that you made it seem like Gwendolyn was the only character.

Other than that, really good!

Kupek
06-19-2007, 09:42 AM
Tone down the radio-announcer voice. You're telling me about the game, not selling to me, so I expect a more conversational tone.

The editing was good. I can understand how it took so long to put that together, because you took the time to have appropriate footage for what you were saying. I also appreciate the on-screen comparison with Princess Crown. I've read people make the comparison, but it was much better being able to see it.

ArugulaZ
06-19-2007, 09:43 PM
Thanks for the comments, gang. Yeah, the voice may be a little over the top, and I'm not sure I have the lungs for it... there were several times in the Odin Sphere review where I ran out of breath before I ran out of sentence, and went from Casey Casem to Bea Arthur in the last couple of words.

I'm debating whether or not to keep the show voice, which was intended as an even blend of Rush Limbaugh's bombastic arrogance, Adam Sessler's girlish neurosis, and Joel Goddard's loud, forceful delivery. The Internet generally eats up quirky stuff like that, but it probably would come at a cost to the credibility of the reviews. I'll probably cut down on the use of "the voice," but not eliminate it entirely.

Reibeatall, I didn't talk about the other characters because... well, I haven't unlocked them yet! I've played Odin Sphere for about six hours and I'm STILL stuck with stinky old Gwen! According to GameFAQs, Princess Crown was the same way... however, UNLIKE Odin Sphere, there's no way I'm going to spend all those hours unlocking the extra scenerios. Forget what you may have read on GameFan; that game stinks out loud!

JR

mr_bungle700
06-19-2007, 10:18 PM
Yes, the voice was too much, though it only bothered me in a few places. The writing was much, much better than many other video reviews I've seen though, and the video itself was nicely made. Just rein in the voice somewhat and I think you'll be fine. As Kupek said, it's better for us to feel like you're telling us about the game rather than selling it to us.

tungwene
06-19-2007, 10:28 PM
Nearing the end. Got two more chapters of Velvet's story to go and I'm hoping everyone's final chapters isn't ungodly long. I stopped for the night because the next area is Titania and I'm starting to loathe that place. If I have to fight another wise man as the chapter boss I think I'm going to scream.

Favorite playable characters:
Mercedes>Velvet>Gwendolyn>Oswald>Cornelius

Favorite stories:
Gwendolyn>Mercedes>Cornelius>Oswald>Velvet

I'm mostly annoyed with Oswald and Velvet's stories because they had the least amount of new information in their stories and there are points in the story where you can't visit your past dungeons. In Oswald's story it made sense but I don't even get why they did it in Velvet's story.

Jakanden
06-20-2007, 05:00 AM
I am still on Mercedes story due to the fact that Wagner is kicking the living crap out of me. I need to level up a bit before taking him on methinks.

tungwene
06-20-2007, 10:26 AM
I think Mercedes has the lowest HP of all the characters. When I fought Oswald with her he was taking her HP down by a third with each hit and I think her level was already in the teens by then. Best to visit the Pooka Village the quickest chance you get.

alexb
06-20-2007, 11:41 AM
I'm debating whether or not to keep the show voice, which was intended as an even blend of Rush Limbaugh's bombastic arrogance, Adam Sessler's girlish neurosis, and Joel Goddard's loud, forceful delivery. The Internet generally eats up quirky stuff like that, but it probably would come at a cost to the credibility of the reviews. I'll probably cut down on the use of "the voice," but not eliminate it entirely.

Sorry man, the voice is really irritating. I think you should cut it out entirely. You come off really smug and Adam Sessler's douchey "the more I overemphasize a word, the funnier it is" style is not one you should be striving to emulate. Talk more normally. Also, I realize that it's the style these days, but everyone's doing the photoshopped slapstick pictures with snarky comments thing. If you're determined to use them, though, don't have them on screen for quite so long. Two or three seconds is enitrely sufficient for people to pick up on it. If you just snap it in and out, it becomes more of a WTF thing, rather than "Look, it's a joke, a joke, don't you get it?" sort of thing.

But really, what you want to do is not copy X-Play, but become the anti-X-play. I fucking hate those guys. Sorry if this seems overly negative. It wasn't bad and your production values were pretty good (I could tell you put quite a bit of work into the transitions and the gameplay scenes you decided to show), but you've been getting a lot of praise from others on the board already, so I thought it would be more useful to you if I was more critical.

(By the way, spot on comment about the quality of the voice acting. I turned on Japanese right after I heard Jesse from Pokemon's voice coming out of the faerie queen, and I've never looked back.)

Jakanden
06-20-2007, 11:59 AM
I think Mercedes has the lowest HP of all the characters. When I fought Oswald with her he was taking her HP down by a third with each hit and I think her level was already in the teens by then. Best to visit the Pooka Village the quickest chance you get.

Part of my problem is I am used to fighting him (via the other two characters) on the ground. I keep flying into him or the whirlwind and not stopping fast enough.

shivam
06-20-2007, 12:12 PM
man, how do you guys get the cash for pooka village?

Jakanden
06-20-2007, 12:18 PM
man, how do you guys get the cash for pooka village?

I generally don't have to buy much. I get a spirit stone first off to pump up my Psypher Level and usually a ring to ward of either Cold or Heat (depending on the level) and that is about it. I also sell almost everything I don't need (seeds I don't use, the onions and such) and focus on getting A and S ratings.

spineshark
06-20-2007, 04:31 PM
Nearing the end. Got two more chapters of Velvet's story to go and I'm hoping everyone's final chapters isn't ungodly long. I stopped for the night because the next area is Titania and I'm starting to loathe that place. If I have to fight another wise man as the chapter boss I think I'm going to scream.

Favorite playable characters:
Mercedes>Velvet>Gwendolyn>Oswald>Cornelius

Favorite stories:
Gwendolyn>Mercedes>Cornelius>Oswald>Velvet
I'm in the same place you are. Get ready for some awful news: the slimes are invulnerable to Velvet's attacks too. I really want to finish Velvet's story, as I'm excited about the ending-she's one of my favorite characters to play but she's pretty awful. Slow moves and wide-area hits that slow her animations even more when lots of enemies are around make it nearly impossible to recover sometimes. Her air combo is good but it tends to miss a lot of hits and even though the chain swing gives her invulnerability...well you can't just stand around being invincible all the time. She was actually great until Chapter 5, when too many enemies can get to her while she's busy finishing her combo (and that battle with two Manticores is disgusting). And it just seems to get worse and worse in chapter 6. But I think the biggest thing is, potions really aren't as good on her as most people.

I'd say my favorite character to play is Gwen, then Velvet, then Mercedes...and probably Oswald before Cornelius because I felt the latter controls too similarly to Gwendolyn. Gwen gets the awesome floaty jumps and Shadow Ally, both of which I love. Mercedes is great and entertaining but really sort of *too* good for her own good.

Storywise I honestly have a hard time remembering what happens in which character's scenes, but Gwen's is my favorite I'm pretty sure. In fact heh, I'm going to go ahead and agree with your order, which is close to what I would think if I thought about it...I think.

tungwene
06-20-2007, 05:44 PM
I like Mercedes because I vastly prefer holding down square to reload instead of standing around waiting for the power bar to recover even if it does mean her power bar doesn't automatically recover. Also she's she's this tiny little girl holding what is essentially the magical equivalent of a gatling gun. What's not to love?

I think Velvet's controls discourage button mashing. Sure she's hard to hit once she starts swinging but if the enemies move out of her not so big range she's just stupidly swinging her chains and you have to wait for her to stop. I like her crouching attack and her double jump and swing her chain in a circle attack. The later works great for bosses, especially if you get behind them, because they tend to be so huge with such a large surface area to land your blows.

What I disliked about Oswald was that he always ran out of power too quickly even when I gave him Unlimited Power potions. Also, he ends his combos by jumping in mid-air which sometimes became really annoying when he kept jumping off of Wagner's head during that one boss fight. Cornelius taught me the importance of flying. I often couldn't even reach normal flying enemies and I didn't like how imprecise his spin attack was.

man, how do you guys get the cash for pooka village?Start saving your Ariel Coins from the start of each character's story. Once I discovered how important those coins were for cooking I immediately stopped spending them on normal items.

ArugulaZ
06-20-2007, 06:23 PM
Sorry man, the voice is really irritating. I think you should cut it out entirely. You come off really smug and Adam Sessler's douchey "the more I overemphasize a word, the funnier it is" style is not one you should be striving to emulate. Talk more normally. Also, I realize that it's the style these days, but everyone's doing the photoshopped slapstick pictures with snarky comments thing. If you're determined to use them, though, don't have them on screen for quite so long. Two or three seconds is enitrely sufficient for people to pick up on it. If you just snap it in and out, it becomes more of a WTF thing, rather than "Look, it's a joke, a joke, don't you get it?" sort of thing.

But really, what you want to do is not copy X-Play, but become the anti-X-play. I fucking hate those guys. Sorry if this seems overly negative. It wasn't bad and your production values were pretty good (I could tell you put quite a bit of work into the transitions and the gameplay scenes you decided to show), but you've been getting a lot of praise from others on the board already, so I thought it would be more useful to you if I was more critical.

(By the way, spot on comment about the quality of the voice acting. I turned on Japanese right after I heard Jesse from Pokemon's voice coming out of the faerie queen, and I've never looked back.)

Well, thanks for the input. I'll take your comments under advisement, although I do like XPlay when it stays on message. Even you would gain a whole new appreciation for the show if you spent any time watching video reviews on YouTube... most of them have no production values at all, and consist of a bored guy muttering obscenities for seven straight minutes. THAT'S the style of review that I want to avoid!

You're probably right about the voice, though. While I want to sound enthusiastic, creating a character rather than just being myself is probably not the way to do it.

JR

ArugulaZ
06-20-2007, 06:42 PM
Oh hey, there was one other thing I wanted to mention. Someone in this thread recommended that I pick up an Xploder HDTV kit for my Playstation 2, telling me that it would take care of the "swimmy" graphics on my television set. They were totally right! Without all those unevenly sized pixels, Odin Sphere looks flawless on my television, with the crisp storybook visuals it was always meant to have. I'm noticing details like lava frothing from the mouths of the rock monsters in the fire stage that didn't show up as well before. Awesome, baby! I can't wait to see how all my OTHER games look with the Xploder!

JR

bobservo
06-23-2007, 08:28 AM
After beating Valkyrie and playing a bit of the second character, I'm ready to ship this game back to GameFly. I just don't like the idea of replaying all of the levels, but with a slightly different new character. This also feels like a "new game minus" feature; instead of being stronger, you start at the bare minimum and have to work your way back up the leveling and alchemy chain all over again. Maybe if the battle system was a little better I could handle how repetitive the game is.

I'm not saying Odin Sphere is bad - well, it's a bad 30 hour game. But it's a GREAT 10-hour game.

tungwene
07-01-2007, 03:52 PM
Beat the game today. The whole last book was pretty awesome and the last two final bosses were two of the most unique bosses in the whole game that made me wish some of the regular boss fights I had to fight repeatedly had displayed as much creativity as those two fights. All the final battles were intense, challenging and really really hard which was a nice change from most final battles in modern RPGs.

I beat them in the correct order and got the good ending. The ending's pretty powerful and satisfying for which I'm thankful for. The last two books had felt very weak to me. Several books could've done with some streamlining. In an effort to give everyone an equal number of chapters per book a lot of books had chapters that felt like they were just in there to pad the gameplay (ex: Mercedes' Wagner chapter comes to mind). It would've been really cool if all five storylines could've been integrated seemlessly without any of the books stories being too repetitive. At least the first three books did manage to accomplish this.

ScrambledGregs
07-02-2007, 02:42 PM
I'm a bit late to the game with this thread, so allow me to just drop all my feelings in one big post.

First: GOD DAMN. Whoever designed Titania in Cornelius's epilogue in Odin Sphere needs to be punched in the throat. I literally cannot beat this boss, and it took me an entire day of trying just to get to it because of the ridiculous ("sup, I'm a green slime who you can only do 1 damage to unless you happen to have Napalm potions on hand"), annoying ("hi, I'm a magician who will teleport each time you hit me, so it takes far too long to kill me"), and simply cheap enemies ("hi, I'm a giant axe wielding guy who will almost instantly land on top of you and take a good half of your life each time I do this"). Then we have the boss, which is the same dragon you fight in Gwendolyn's first boss fight, only now he's got an army of all the annoying enemies you've been fighting all along to get to him, horrendous slowdown, and more powerful versions of the same cheap moves that pissed you off the first time.

Odin Sphere is a triumph of aesthetics over gameplay. I wanted so bad to love this game, so it goes against every fiber of my being to do so because it's as if someone designed a game to appeal to me but did everything wrong as far as the gameplay goes. Much like Vagrant Story and Final Fantasy VIII, if I didn't have to play the thing I would love it. Despite the old school look and feel, Odin Sphere's got the same problem I find a lot of Japanese RPGs have had since the beginning of time: difficulty is not derived from strategy choices or skill so much as grinding and item gathering preparation.

Do you remember in the old days when you'd play a game, and right away you'd have all the possible skills you needed?? Or at the very least, you got them as the game went along?? And if you ever got 'stuck' in the game, it was due to some defect in your skill or poor strategy?? Well, most modern RPGs are the antithesis of this. As long as you have the patience and free time, you can beat anything. The problem is that I simply do not have the time or patience anymore. I play games to relax and have fun, but I also don't want to be coddled. For example, I think that Paper Mario on Gamecube is childishly easy to the extent that I couldn't even finish it. All of my favorite games aren't hand holding fests; they work so well because the difficulty comes from trying to overcome the game's obstacles with what you're given/can acquire instead of having to waste time grinding levels or farming items.

The fact that Odin Sphere is an action RPG where reflexes and skills are worthless is most damning of all. A game like Secret of Mana or the recent 2D Castlevanias are possible to beat even if you are underleveled or don't have the right weapon/item. But they also aren't button mashers, Mana especially, yet they work better than Odin Sphere's combat. Remember Mega Man: sure, you were supposed to use specific weapons on each robot, but you could beat them using only the basic weapon if you were psychotic enough to try. Even something completely unique like Ico, which I recently played through, was difficult, but not unfair. You're given everything you need to overcome the game's obstacles, so if you can't figure out a puzzle or can't do a platform sequence, it's your fault and not the fact that your Grip skill isn't at a high enough level or you don't have a Potion of Crate Stacking. I often wanted to snap my controller over my knee while playing Ico, but when I finally completed certain tasks, I felt a sense of accomplishment because *I* was the one who did it, not the fact that I accumulated enough numbers or finally got the right item off an enemy I had to fight 20 times to get the right drop.

All of this ranting is my way of saying, maybe I'm just tired of hardcore games, RPGs in particular. Which is strange, because I really enjoyed and loved both Dragon Quest VIII and Final Fantasy XII, which if anything are more old school and complicated than Odin Sphere. I really, really want to love Odin Sphere, but it's so much wasted potential obscured by the problems that mar almost all modern Japanese RPGs: powerleveling overrides skill and strategy. Anymore, I feel like I'm becoming a casual gamer because I want something that's going to be fun and yet challenging for 10 to 20 hours (modern Castlevania's come to mind) or is just an open ended fun kind of game you can play over and over (stuff like Meteos or most Wii games).

Is this all just a side effect of getting older and not having the time/patience to spend on a 60 hour game, or are most modern games really just the frustrating, arbitrary time sinks that I think they are??

Meg
07-02-2007, 04:16 PM
Sometimes changing the difficulty setting makes or breaks a game. For example, everyone was talking about Zone of Enders: The Second Runner a while back, right? I was intrigued, so I picked up a used copy. I found out I kinda suck at it after a few chapters, though, so after I reluctantly switched to the easy mode, I really started having fun. Is there a difficulty setting in Odin Sphere? It may feel childish to play at the easier settings, but if that's what it takes to enjoy a game, do it!

I got Odin Sphere when it came out, but I only play it once every week or two (I just unlocked the Pooka village in Gwen's story), so it's going to be a long, long time before I ever finish it (if ever). I think playing the game in small bites instead of trying to rush to the end helps keep the frustration down, but you obviously won't win any land speed records this way.

I've noticed that I'm not as patient for long or padded games as I used to be (RPGs in particular; how did I ever beat Xenogears?). I don't feel like I'm a casual gamer, but I'm just as happy with shorter games now, so I turn on the Wii and repair that poor guy's fractured arm in Trauma Center all the time. It's like some twisted addiction.

ScrambledGregs
07-02-2007, 08:28 PM
Funnily enough, I was playing Odin Sphere on easy mode since the beginning of the game.

spineshark
07-02-2007, 09:12 PM
Yeah, the difference between Easy and Hard is laughable. Enemies do only about 10% more damage and have 20%-ish more HP, although I'm less sure on the latter, for probably obvious reasons.

What I found was that the game started off pretty fun but pretty quickly got staler and staler over the next thirty-some hours...until Velvet's final boss. Everything after that point was, well, far from perfect, but incredibly amazing nonetheless.

And hey, the game is pretty and the story is really cool...it could still be worse...

tungwene
07-03-2007, 05:08 PM
I'm a bit late to the game with this thread, so allow me to just drop all my feelings in one big post.

First: GOD DAMN. Whoever designed Titania in Cornelius's epilogue in Odin Sphere needs to be punched in the throat. I literally cannot beat this boss, and it took me an entire day of trying just to get to it because of the ridiculous ("sup, I'm a green slime who you can only do 1 damage to unless you happen to have Napalm potions on hand"), annoying ("hi, I'm a magician who will teleport each time you hit me, so it takes far too long to kill me"), and simply cheap enemies ("hi, I'm a giant axe wielding guy who will almost instantly land on top of you and take a good half of your life each time I do this"). Then we have the boss, which is the same dragon you fight in Gwendolyn's first boss fight, only now he's got an army of all the annoying enemies you've been fighting all along to get to him, horrendous slowdown, and more powerful versions of the same cheap moves that pissed you off the first time.

Odin Sphere is a triumph of aesthetics over gameplay. I wanted so bad to love this game, so it goes against every fiber of my being to do so because it's as if someone designed a game to appeal to me but did everything wrong as far as the gameplay goes. Much like Vagrant Story and Final Fantasy VIII, if I didn't have to play the thing I would love it. Despite the old school look and feel, Odin Sphere's got the same problem I find a lot of Japanese RPGs have had since the beginning of time: difficulty is not derived from strategy choices or skill so much as grinding and item gathering preparation.

Do you remember in the old days when you'd play a game, and right away you'd have all the possible skills you needed?? Or at the very least, you got them as the game went along?? And if you ever got 'stuck' in the game, it was due to some defect in your skill or poor strategy?? Well, most modern RPGs are the antithesis of this. As long as you have the patience and free time, you can beat anything. The problem is that I simply do not have the time or patience anymore. I play games to relax and have fun, but I also don't want to be coddled. For example, I think that Paper Mario on Gamecube is childishly easy to the extent that I couldn't even finish it. All of my favorite games aren't hand holding fests; they work so well because the difficulty comes from trying to overcome the game's obstacles with what you're given/can acquire instead of having to waste time grinding levels or farming items.

The fact that Odin Sphere is an action RPG where reflexes and skills are worthless is most damning of all. A game like Secret of Mana or the recent 2D Castlevanias are possible to beat even if you are underleveled or don't have the right weapon/item. But they also aren't button mashers, Mana especially, yet they work better than Odin Sphere's combat. Remember Mega Man: sure, you were supposed to use specific weapons on each robot, but you could beat them using only the basic weapon if you were psychotic enough to try. Even something completely unique like Ico, which I recently played through, was difficult, but not unfair. You're given everything you need to overcome the game's obstacles, so if you can't figure out a puzzle or can't do a platform sequence, it's your fault and not the fact that your Grip skill isn't at a high enough level or you don't have a Potion of Crate Stacking. I often wanted to snap my controller over my knee while playing Ico, but when I finally completed certain tasks, I felt a sense of accomplishment because *I* was the one who did it, not the fact that I accumulated enough numbers or finally got the right item off an enemy I had to fight 20 times to get the right drop.

All of this ranting is my way of saying, maybe I'm just tired of hardcore games, RPGs in particular. Which is strange, because I really enjoyed and loved both Dragon Quest VIII and Final Fantasy XII, which if anything are more old school and complicated than Odin Sphere. I really, really want to love Odin Sphere, but it's so much wasted potential obscured by the problems that mar almost all modern Japanese RPGs: powerleveling overrides skill and strategy. Anymore, I feel like I'm becoming a casual gamer because I want something that's going to be fun and yet challenging for 10 to 20 hours (modern Castlevania's come to mind) or is just an open ended fun kind of game you can play over and over (stuff like Meteos or most Wii games).

Is this all just a side effect of getting older and not having the time/patience to spend on a 60 hour game, or are most modern games really just the frustrating, arbitrary time sinks that I think they are??There are a few more notable differences about the difficulty settings. Enemies release more phozons the easier your difficulty setting and your psypher gauge has more levels. For example a level 31 psypher has a psypher gauge of 7 on normal and a psypher gauge of 9 on easy.

Honestly, I think the phozons system discouraged grinding since it divorced combat from HP gain. It's quite feasible to push some character's, like Oswald, HP into into the 2000's quite painlessly as early as the second chapter if that's what you want to do. I think Odin Sphere is a game that can be frighteningly hard but it rewards gamers for experimenting with the system. Can't seem to pull off enough Phozon Bursts or cast Overload enough times during a boss fight because you're psypher gauge runs out and you haven't enough room in your bags for three X phozon potions? Tried just having a 50-material and an Onionne/Carroteer in your bag and mixing them when in a pinch? You can button mash your way through the game without doing any of these things but like you said yourself the game rewards more for igenuity than you think it does. It may not take you any shorter to beat the game that way since it requires some trial and error but it's certainly more emotionally satisfying.

And for the record, Titania is worst dungeon in this game.

ScrambledGregs
07-03-2007, 07:06 PM
Yeah, but you can't REALLY button mash in Odin Sphere. It may seem like a viable tactic until you get to those stages that are rated 5 stars ans you fight swarms of enemies. Sure, button mashing in Secret of Mana isn't a viable tactic either because you end up doing piecemeal damage, but at least your character doesn't get dizzy when you keep hammering the A button.

I give Odin Sphere a lot of credit for being of the most unique experiences I've ever had on a console. But it's the sort of game I'll never be able to force myself to finish because it ends up feeling like homework to me rather than something I can have fun and relax with.

ArugulaZ
07-03-2007, 08:22 PM
Yeah, the game is entirely too stretched out for its own good. Princess Crown was the same way, but at least Odin Sphere has the benefit of being fun to play!

JR

tungwene
07-03-2007, 09:16 PM
I would think button mashing would be more viable in a 5 star level simply because you get hit so much and taking damage automatically refills your POW. And for the rest of time you have Unlimited Power potions.

Torgo
07-13-2007, 10:57 AM
Started last night. Valkyrie, Chapter 3. I really dig the boss and miniboss fights, but the regular battles feel kinda spartan. Between the dialogue, battle ratings, and travel between individual spheres, the action just feels kinda broken up and it's tough to really get into it

I can get over that though, 'cause it's all pretty darn good. However, my biggest grief, and I don't care how expandable it is, but the limited inventory sucks balls. Seriously, that crap needs to disappear from games post haste.

tungwene
07-13-2007, 11:47 AM
I didn't like the limited inventory at first but then I realized it was the game's way to encourage you to be constantly eating and planting seeds so that you level up not just your psypher but your HP too.

Kishi
07-13-2007, 01:59 PM
The fact that you can save up money to increase your space just adds to the overall strategy. I like it.

Torgo
07-13-2007, 02:02 PM
Okay yeah, it's starting to come together a bit more. Hopefully bags with more space ultimately become available?

discoalucard
07-13-2007, 02:24 PM
Yeah, the game is entirely too stretched out for its own good. Princess Crown was the same way, but at least Odin Sphere has the benefit of being fun to play!

JR

Wow someone else actually agrees with me about Princess Crown. I hear it lauded left and right, but I found the game boring, sluggish and frustrating. It actually made me appreciate Odin Sphere a lot more though. Odin Sphere still suffers from some of the same inherent issues (the fighting is kind of sloppy) but most of the REALLY annoying stuff has been fixed. As cheap as Odin Sphere is, at least the only penalty for death is restarting the stage. Imagine if you had to start the whole chapter over. And the fighting was really awful and not fun at all. That's what Princess Crown is like.

Pretty, though.

tungwene
07-13-2007, 02:34 PM
Okay yeah, it's starting to come together a bit more. Hopefully bags with more space ultimately become available?I wanna say bags start going on sale in chapter 4 but I honestly can't remember. However you can buy bags much earlier in all the other characters' stories.