The Phantasy Star series

[Kazin]

Drawn the path of the last map for Phantasy Star II:

Kinda sad, tbh. I've sort of come to like doing this? Even with the full path laid out, these dungeons aren't easy to navigate/survive through. That's quite a walk, too, though I've loaded up on Trimates and hope to arrive at the bosses at full HP/MP. Hopefully my next post in this thread is of a credits screen... That'll be after work, though, I'm not finishing the game on my Nomad, I want some nice s-video CRT action for whatever the ending is.

 

[FelixSH]

It grows on you, doesn't it? I'm looking forward to your report on the bosses, and the ending.
Also, thanks for sharing your impressions. I apparently love talking about this game, and hearing about it from others.

 

[Kazin]

I did it.

I really enjoyed the final stretch of the game. Spoilers for I guess the first two games in the series: So people from Earth were behind the whole crisis? Like, our Earth? And they apparently really did destroy Palma - they were somehow behind that satellite crashing into it that we were rescued from. Given the final dungeon was called "Noah" and they said they came from Earth, they really did spoil the planet were looking for a new one... Neat!

Why the heck was Dark Force in a treasure box? I mean, I get that it outright called itself "Pandora's Box," but is it the same entity from the first game? I wouldn't be surprised if Phantasy Star IV explained this, but I can't remember what it said about it if anything (it's been quite a while since I played it). Man, though, that battle - it is a random crapshoot. I'm glad I saved right in front of it, because it took me three tries - the first two I got wiped pretty quickly because it kept making everybody "evil," but the final time it mainly attacked, and Deban lowered how much damage it did, and NaRes plus the piles of Trimates I had saw me through. It's a nice touch the final two battles don't show you how much damage you're doing - it makes them more edge of your seat then they'd otherwise be, because while I could look up how much HP each boss has, it doesn't make any difference since I don't know how much damage I'm doing. Made me play maybe a bit more defensively than I otherwise might've. In any case, I managed to get through both bosses with everyone alive, not that it mattered (I went back to Esper Mansion to heal and save after beating Dark Force, I did *not* want to risk doing that fight again, though I did beat Mother Brain on my first try afterwards. Turns out being able to control your party makes an enormous difference to battle difficulty lol).

I took a few photos of the ending scenes, including these two of Shir (shoutout to @Peklo, Shir is cool and I'll use her more next time) and Rolf:

RIP to Rieko Kodama (I can't believe they were still being forced to use fake names in the credits at this point, ugh):

I had a good time playing this, I'm glad I finally pushed past Neifirst. I really enjoyed it, even with the rough dungeons and the weird freeze I encountered when I first received the Neisword (the music stopped and if I attempted to use the sword to go back to Esper Mansion, the game froze - I tried it this way twice. I had to save after getting the sword, shut the Genesis off, then everything worked fine. Super strange. Glad I didn't go fight the bosses before figuring that weird glitch out). I thought this was a great way to end things before the credits, too:

 

[FelixSH]

Yeah, I think these are straight up our deacendants, after we/they completely ruin Earth. Not only did they destroy Palma, they also blame Rolf and the rest on it. They did save the world(s), while everyone thinks they are criminals.

I know, I'm repeating myself, but this game is so bleak. Just no bit of light anywhere.

I'm glad you actually had an easier time than me, with Dark Force. I do think that it's weird, being there. Like, humans here are the worst, but absolutely believable. It's not necessary to have some cosmic, evil force taking the blame. We are absolutely capable of killing the whole population of a planet on our own.

PS IV just stats that every 1000 years, Dark Force has enough power to try destroying everything again, iirc (my memory is bad). I think it just cheapens the story here.

But aside from that, this game is just so fascinating and well done, regarding story and worldbuilding.

 

[Peklo]

Hell yeah. Glad you enjoyed it. It's not the game in the series that's the most conducive to breezy replays, but it has undeniable qualities that will stick with you, regardless if you view them as successes, failures, or anything else.

I halfway fib about Shir, but I'm also serious, so things I like about her:

• good pun name--probably among the more entertaining end results of the series's copious naming changes in localization
• the character designs for this game, including the shopkeeper portraits, are probably the height of the series embodying the anime zeitgeist aesthetics of their period--big hair, big shoulders, colourful yet plain and readable designs. The ending shots alone are extremely impressive for a 1989 cartridge game, before such visuals in RPGs in the console space had become commonplace, or dominant as eventually seen on platforms like PC Engine. In that context, Shir is among the funnest character designs in the cast, for being just a person in an adventure tunic.
• I like that she's not all that great in battle. A lot of thief characters and thief classes in RPGs, especially later down the line, are built and depicted as these superhero flipmasters and critical-hitting monsters whose battle efficacy often doesn't lag behind a burly warrior type or a spellcaster... it just operates through different stats and tools. Shir in context of Phantasy Star II is a thief who can sometimes do specific things no one else can, and the things she can do like others she doesn't do half as well. It renders her pleasingly normal and mundane instead of a character who can do it all.
• this is not a game that embellishes its cast with copious backstory, but Shir's supplementary background as a privileged hedonist who just seeks a good adventure and thrill for the fun of it is pretty great juxtaposition for a game as bleak as the one she exists in.
• I think she genuinely has one of my favourite implementations of stealing as a mechanic in an RPG. Swiping the savepoint is something almost everyone does if they're clued into it for practical reasons, but that the only context in which she steals is at stores and not in battles from monsters and the like is already unusual for how the genre typically operates. To me the most significant aspect about her thieving sprees is that they're entirely outside of the player's direction; they are just the result of providing the character with an opportunity that she might take advantage of on her own because of circumstance. It frames her as an autonomous entity that keeps even her own allies on their toes with her whims, which is just terrific inferred characterization through mechanics.
• she's 22, which is a data point that makes her older than the protagonist and older in general than genre trends often allow for.
• she got that one snake real good:

 

[Kazin]

The weird thing about Dark Force, @FelixSH, is that there is no hint of it until that point, and the Earth people don't really seem to imply they made it or own it or anything, I guess it was just there? I'm not really sure. Shame PSIV didn't go into any more detail on it than that.

Oh wow, she did get that one snake real good @Peklo lol. But her ending scene really is cool - there are explosions in the background, implying that she caused them, and all she's doing is holding a knife aloft lol. But yeah, I can see where Phantasy Star IVs cutscenes came from - I immediately thought of them when seeing those ending screens. Maybe I should try those text adventure games out...

I booted up Phantasy Star III, and got farther in it than I ever have before - I got a second party character lmao. I've never really given it a chance because I've heard its reputation isn't too great, but so far it's fine, really. I kinda like some of the graphics, and the little Rappy birds from Phantasy Star Online are here (okay, I guess they would've come from this game, obviously, but I played this series wayyyy out of order lol). What is going on with the battle menu, though? It's so weird. Like, I figured out that you can advance things by one turn, or just set it to auto, but no words on screen until action happens is quite a choice. And the music in the battles is all over the place, I don't really understand why. But at this point, this is the last Phantasy Star I've not beaten (I didn't play Phantasy Star Universe, but I did play and love Zero on DS and intend on eventually playing through the Portable games), so I'm going to try to see it through. Nothing is turning me off yet, at least.

 

[estragon]

Glad you made it through.

If you go on to Phantasy Star III at any point, I definitely recommend this retranslation.

In general, I'm not a huge fan of retranslations, because so many are misguided and not improvements. For example, I think Phantasy Star's original localization is much better than the much lauded fan retranslation that came out, both because the original better captures the spirit and meaning of the original text.

But in Phantasy Star III's case, the original localization has enough problems to warrant a re-do (cutting "talk to everyone and figure out what to do by synthesizing information" style exploration puzzles and turning them into a line of dialogue that says "go exactly here" and making lots of errors both large and small), and the retranslation is a a huge improvement. I spotted a few mistakes in the retranslation as well, but it still improves the English script from like an F to an A-.

 

[Kazin]

Well, I have an original cartridge I want to play these games on, so despite having an Everdrive, I kinda want to experience these games the first time as what they would have felt like back in the 90s because I'm a weirdo like that. I appreciate the heads up, though, and if Phantasy Star III is as intriguing a play as the first two games, I'm sure I'll replay it eventually (yes, I know it's supposedly the worst one, but I'd also heard II was pretty unapproachable and I had a good time with it).

 

[estragon]

That make sense.

Personally, III is my second favorite (I->III--->IV->remembering II------------------------------>actually playing II), but unfortunately a lot of what I like about it is not present in the very muddled original English translation.

 

[Kazin]

That much better, eh? Will I be more invested in the plot, or is it just less direct instructions on where to go next? I ask because I primarily want to play through it for the story, I guess.

 

[Sarge]

Good job getting through the game! I've been tempted to play through it again some day, except with the modified version on the Genesis Mini 2. Got to think fast walking and less grinding would make for a breezier experience, even if those dungeons are like... hooooo boy.

 

[estragon]

That much better, eh? Will I be more invested in the plot, or is it just less direct instructions on where to go next? I ask because I primarily want to play through it for the story, I guess.

I can't say whether or not you'll be more invested, but, if you're playing for the story, I'd say Rebecca Capowski's translation is close to a requirement, because you're not going to get the story of Phantasy Star III from the official English release. It's full of errors, omissions, and tons of stuff they just made up.

 

[FelixSH]

Multiple party members probably means, that you are further than I ever got. It's the only one of the four games I haven't beaten (or given a fair chance). I mainly remember liking the artstyle less. Less cartoony and colorful, at least in my memory.

Some day, it will happen.

 

[Kazin]

I can't say whether or not you'll be more invested, but, if you're playing for the story, I'd say Rebecca Capowski's translation is close to a requirement, because you're not going to get the story of Phantasy Star III from the official English release. It's full of errors, omissions, and tons of stuff they just made up.

Welp, that pretty much settles it, then. You're also the first person I've seen rate III above IV, too, and I liked IV a good deal, so I guess I'm playing this translation, then!

 

[Kazin]

So there are things I like about the retranslation already, but what the heck is SunForce, StarForc, MoonFroc, and SeaForce?! Which one is Res, which one is Anti, and what are the other two? Dangit. I wish they'd have kept the spell names literally the rest of the series uses so I know which is which.

EDIT: Oh, and I applied the parallax patch fix to this, too, which I like, because the battle screens are much more interesting looking now. Didn't do the walking speed fix because I just played through Phantasy Star II vanilla, I can handle slow walking speed lmao

 

[Peklo]

You're also the first person I've seen rate III above IV, too, and I liked IV a good deal, so I guess I'm playing this translation, then!

It does track to me from how I generally see the series discussed. IV's design sensibilities lean much closer to the kind of RPG that especially in retrospect is accepted as the idealized median for the format, with much less attrition, resistance and proactive exploration as part of the experience in favour of tightly directed sequences and plenty of diverse momentum. Sometimes people are not all that hot on any game in the series except that one, generally for those reasons and the division that exists between its predecessors, but if your preferences diverge, there are plenty of reasons to think highly of any of the other three. I think that's part of the lasting power of the four games, in that they somehow managed to track as an unified work in the indefinable throughlines between one another while each embodying a totally different kind of game in the particulars.

 

[Kazin]

Yeah, that's why I'm forcing myself to play III, because I've really enjoyed the other games in the series, even though I'd always heard IV is kinda the only one worth playing. Even if my expectations are low - and I admit, they still are, for III - the generational thing is interesting to me. I wonder if I'll like it enough to play through it more than once to see the different endings.

 

[Sarge]

While I think PSIV is easily the best of the series, I agree that all of them have aspects that make them worth playing. Granted, PSII's grindy nature might get to me now, but I loved it back in the day. And I'll always have a soft spot for PSIII, despite it feeling quite different. That one gets too much flak in my opinion. The one I enjoy the least is the first game, and it's nothing to do with the world, just that I don't care for the game's combat.

 

[Kazin]

Played some more III on my lunch. Got to the desert area, looking for someone named Wren, who is apparently in a cave to the west. He can apparently fix a weather tower that will help the people in the frozen area I just went through. Battles are quite frequent, but they go by fast, especially with the text speed on 8 (which I only set so I could see when battles start if I was ambushed or had advantage lol). Dungeons, so far, have been extremely simple compared to II, to the point where I haven't even had to look up a single map yet. Quite a different experience. It's pretty clear something is up with this world - a weather control tower? Metal structures inside caves? Androids? This isn't a traditional medieval world haha

 

[FelixSH]

Do you know anything about the story of PS III? I always assume people who played the other games know at least the big stuff of III, but that's probably nonsense.

 

[Kazin]

I think I know the big story thing of III, but I may be confusing it with II now, having finished that game? Been a while since I heard whatever I did about III haha (it takes place on a giant spaceship or something like that? But maybe I'd misheard the ending of II, where the Earthlings appear on their Noah's Ark)

 

[Kazin]

Got my fifth party member in Phantasy Star III, and I think I'm getting close to the end of the first generation since apparently the person I'm trying to rescue is in the next area across a bridge I just made by making two moons move (?). Dunno if that's the case or not, I'm not trying to look ahead in a FAQ. I am looking at overworld maps, though, as they are pretty large and are mostly empty. Dungeons are still farily simple, although the weather tower was pretty complex.

In any case, I'm having a decent time so far. The game is not bad at all, though, just quite a run of the mill JRPG, really. I do like how fast battles go, they can take quite a while in II in comparison.

 

[Kazin]

Okay! Beat the first generation on my lunch. Chose to marry Marina (Maia, I think, in the original release?). I saved Ain's game in the second slot - should I make a backup of my save so I don't have to replay Kein/Rhys's scenario again if I want to get the other endings? Or is there some kind of New Game + situation that wouldn't force me to do that?

 

[estragon]

There's no New Game+.

 

[Kazin]

Back up it is! Thanks!